Proceedings of the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly assembled at 9.00 A.M. Wednesday, the 19th March 1975, in the Assembly Chamber, Shillong.

Present :-  Hon'ble Speaker in the Chair, 7 Ministers 3 Minister of State and 32 hon. Members.

QUESTION AND ANSWERS

UNSTARRED QUESTIONS

(To which replies were laid on the Table)

Mr. Speaker :- Let us begin the business of the day to taking up unstarred question No. 57.

Two per cent cut from each bill of Tribal Contractors as Income tax.

Shri Lewis Bareh asked :- 

57.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Works Department be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether the tribal contractors in Meghalaya are subjected to 2 per cent cut from each bill for Public Works Department work as Income tax ?

(b)

If so there any circular issued for the same ?

(c)

The names  of the tribal contractors in the Jowai Public Works Department Division from whom the said 2 per cent cut has so far been effected ?

(d)

The amount deducted from each and the period involved ?

(e)

Whether Government Propose to take steps to release the same ?

(f)

If so the procedure to be followed by the said contractors for getting refund of the amount ?

Shri P. Ripple Kyndiah (Minister in charge of Public Works Department) :-  replied :- 

57.(a)

Tribal contractors are subjected to the deduction of Income tax if they do not obtain the Income tax exemption certificate.

(b)

Yes a copy of the circular is placed on the Table of the House.

(c)&(d)

The particulars are furnished in the list placed on the Table of the House.

(e)

The Government will release the amount on the authorization if Income tax Office.

(f)

The contractor will have to file the Income tax returns for claiming refunds.

Shri Lewis Bareh :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, 57(c) may we know the reason why the names of some persons appearing in the list placed on the Table as No. 50.56.31.32.33. have been omitted ?

Shri P. R. Kyndiah  Minister of P.W.D. :-  This has been laid on the Table.

Mr. Speaker :-  But he said that from the list placed on the Table of the House the Names of these persons have been omitted. 

Shri P. R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :- I want notice Sir,

Mr. Speaker :-  Unstarred question No. 58.

Deputation of Officers for training to the Indian Institute of Mass Communication.

Shri D. Dethwelson Lapang asked :- 

58.

Will the Minister in charge of Information and Public  Relations be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether  it is a fact that the Government has deputed some officers for training to the India Institute of Mass Communication

(b)

If so whether it is a fact that the course of training was short ?

(c)

Whether the Government has deputed its officers to undergo a one year course of training either in the same institution in Delhi or in  some Universities outside Meghalaya.

(d) 

If so how many departmental officers have been deputed for such advanced courses ?

Shri Darwin D. Pugh Minister of Information and Public Relations replied :- 

58(a)

Yes Sir,

(b)

Yes Sir,

(c)

No. Sir,

(d)

Does not arise.

Shri D. D. Lapang :-  May we know the names of those officers ?

Shri D. D. Pugh Minister of Information and Public Relations :-  Shri H. G. Lyngdoh at present serving as Jt. Director of Information and Public Relations ; Shri B. P Domes Liaison Officer ; Shri H. R. C. Nongrum District Information and Public Relations Officer; Shri  G. Marak Liaison Officer Tura Shri Michael Shylla Dark Room Operator.

Shri D. D. Lapang :- For how many months training Sir.

Shri  D. D. Pugh Minister of Information and Public Relation :-  One month in the case of Shri Lyngdoh and three months each in the case of Shri Domes, Shri Nongrum and Shri Marak. In the  case of Michel Shylla for a three weeks course.

Mr. Speaker :-  Unstarred Question No 59.

Construction of new culverts on the Gauhati-Shillong Road 

Shri Pritington Sangma asked :-     

59.

Will the Minister in charge of P.W.D. be pleased to State :-

(a)

The number of new culverts and bridges proposed to be constructed on the Gauhati Shillong Road ?

(b)

The estimated amount involved ?

(c)

Whether it is a fact that some of the culvert are not necessary ?

Shri P. Ripple Kyndiah Minister In charge of P.W.D. replied :- 

59(a)

There are no new culverts and bridges to be constructed. It is however proposed to reconstruct 310 culvert and 13 bridges on the road.

(b).

Rupees 60.07.700

(c) 

No. All the culverts are necessary.

Shri S. P. Swer:-  Mr. Speaker Sir, in reply to (a) the Minister has replied that are construction of about 310 culverts and 13 bridges proposed to be taken up. My question is what kind of materials  the Government propose to use in the reconstruction of the culverts?

Shri P. R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :-  Well the material proposed are good materials materials usually done in this kind of work.

Duty of the Gram Sevaks and the Senior Gram Sevaks.

Shri Samarendra Sangma asked :- 

60.

Will the Minster incharge of Community Development be pleased to state:-

(a)

Whether there is any difference between the duties of the Gram Sevaks and the Senior Gram Sevaks at the Block level ?

(b)

The specific functions of the Senior Gram Sevaks at the Block level ?

(c)

Whether the Senior Gram Sevaks are fully discharging their duties unhampered by any agency ?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh Minister in charge of Community Development replied 

60.(a)

The Senior Gram Sevak supervises the work of the Gram Sevaks under the guidance of the  B.D.O.

(b)

He collects and maintains the agricultural data of the villages in the Block from the Grams Sevaks under the guidance of the E. O (Agri); gives the Gram Sevaks advice in the preparation of the village production plans helps and  advises them in conducting agricultural demonstrations organizes village leader training camps and performs any other jobs in the interest of Community Development Programme allotted to him by the B.D.O.

(c)

Yes.

Drilling for Baghmara Water Supply Scheme

Shri Brojendro Sangma asked :- 

61.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering be pleased to state :-

(a)

The number of places where drilling has been undertaken so far for Baghmara Water Supply Scheme ?

(b)

The number of those which are successful ? 

(c)

The total amount incurred so far for drilling works alone ?

Shri Sandford K. Marak Minister in charge of P. H. E. replied :- 

61.(a)

4 (four)

(b)

1 (one) Work on another is in progress.

(c)

Rs. 52,315,00.

New Water Supply Schemes.

Shri Pleander Gare Momin asked :- 

62.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Health engineering  be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether it is a fact that new water supply schemes for the following villages have been taken up by the Government:-

(i)-Jambal village (ii)-Nongcharam village (iii)-Darengiri village (iv)-Mangsang village ?

(b)

If so when is the implementation of these schemes expected to start ?

Shri Sandford K. Marak Minister in charge of P. H. E. replied :- 

62 (a) 

Darengiri Water Supply Scheme has been taken up by the P. H. E. Department and work is in progress.

(b)

The other villages are under survey and investigation and schemes will be taking up if found feasible.

Construction of R. C. C.  Bridge over Krishnai River

Shri Pleander Gare Momin asked :- 

63.

Will the Minister in charge of P.W.D. be pleases to state:-

(a)

Whether the Government propose to construct R. C. C. Bridge over the Krishnai river on the Resubelpara Bajengdoba P.W.D. Road ?

(b)

If so when ?

(c)

Whether it is a fact that the Government propose to set up a new P.W.D. subdivision with headquarters at Rongjeng ?

(d)

If so when will it start functioning ?

Shri P. Ripple Kyndiah Minister in charge of P.W.D. (R & B) replied :- 

63(a)

Yes

(b)

The work will  be taken up in the next financial year 1975-76.

(c)

Yes

(d)

The subdivision is likely to start functioning early in the next financial year.

Mini-Hydel Projects

Shri Onward Leyswell Nongtdu asked :- 

64.

Will the Minister in charge of Power be pleased to state :- 

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the Government proposes to set up few mini hydel projects in the state ?

(b)

If so what are the project proposed to be taken up during 1975-76.

Shri Stanley D. D. Nichols Roy Minister in charge of Power relied :- 

64(a)

Investigation are being proposed.

(b)

The names of the schemes are yet to be finalised pending investigation.

Shri H. Hadem :-  64(b) what are those schemes under investigation ?

Shri S. D. D. Nichols Roy Minister of Power :- Mr. Speaker Sir, the answer to No. 64 is that the investigation are being proposed. That means that the investigations are not yet started. Only a map and proposal are being prepared and a list of these proposals is in hand  but the investigations have not yet been started.

Transfer of Officers of the Public Work Department

Shri Sibendra Narayan Koch asked :-

65

Will the Minister in charge of P.W.D. be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether there were transfers of Officers serving in the P.W.D. in the months of Septembers Octobers, 1974 ?

(b)

If so the named of the such Officers with their original headquarters and new place of posting ?

(c)

Whether all the Officers so transferred moved to their place of new posting ?

(d)

If not the reason thereof ?

Shri P. Ripple Kyndiah Minister in charge of P.W.D. replied :- 

65(a)

Yes

(b)

The list is placed on the Table of the House.

(c)

No.

(d)

In some cases the order of transfer was not made effective in the interest of public service.

Shri H. Hadem :-  65(b)  may we know whether those orders were cancelled ?

Shri P. R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :-  They are kept pending.

Crash Programme in the Block for Rural Employment

Shri Samarendra Sangma asked :-

66.

Will the Minister  in charge of Community Development be pleased to state :-

(a)

whether the Crash Programme in the Block meant  for rural employment is spread the out the whole year ?

(b)

If not why not ?

(c)

Whether Government is aware of the fact that under such crash programme people get works only for three to four months and are out of job for the rest of the years ?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh (Minister of Community Development) replied

66 (a)

Unusually not.

(b) & (c)

Crash Scheme for Rural employment were implemented in all the 24 Development Blocks of the State. Project were prepared with the help of Block Development Committee for each Block within the clock wise allocation. The projects mostly undertaken were construction and improvement of roads minor irrigation works flood protection and other  small schemes. Few of the projects were big enough to provide employment throughout the year in a sizeable proportion. Moreover these works could not be executed during the rainy season and immediately there after when people were usually busy with  harvesting of the crops. The projects thus, were generally executed during the slack season providing employment to the rural population during this period.

               Crash Schemes for Rural Employment is intended to relieve unemployment and under employment in the rural areas.

               The Government of India have discontinued the Crash Schemes for Rural employment with effect from April 1974. and no fresh projects have been undertaken during 1974-75.

  
Shri H. Hadem :- 
No.66  last paragraph of the reply. May we know the reasons for discontinuance of the scheme?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister Community Development ;-  The Government of India has not given the reason.

Shri S. P. Swer ;-  Mr. Speaker Sir, (b) and (c). In the reply it has been stated that the projects mostly undertaken were construction and improvement of roads. My questions is whether the Government propose to provide funds for maintenance and repairs of these projects ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister Community Development :-  Not yet Sir.

Roads recommended for construction in Border Areas. 

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna asked :- 

67.

Will the Minister in charge of Border Area Development be pleased to state ;- 

(a)

 The name of the roads in the Border Areas which have been recommended for construction by the Public Works Department by the meeting of the M.L.As representing Border Areas ?

(b)

 The names of the roads since taken up for construction ?

(c)

The name of the water Supply schemes recommended for implementation by the meeting of the M.L.A representing the Border Areas ?

(d)

The number so far implemented ?

(e)

The names of the schemes not implemented and reason for non implementation ?

Shri Blooming B. Shallam Minister of State Border Area Development replied :-

67(a)(1)

Bala-Ryngku-Shella

(2)

Ichamati-Kalatek

(3)

Mawmihthied-Mawsahew-Tynrong

(4)

Wahshierkhmut-Umniuhtmar.

(5)

Khlieh Sai Ulam-Sohkmie-Suktia.

(6)

Phlangdiloin Nolikata (Bazar) via Ranikor.

(7)

Dakubazar-Dimapara via Mibonpara.

(8)

Missing link between Ampati and Purakhasia

(9)

Dimapara-Dapgiri

(10)

Nibonpara-Kherapara.

(11)

Betasing-Ichakuri

(12)

Metapgiri-Sibbari via Rongrikimgiri

(13)

Dambuk-Aga-Dambuk Apal

(14)

Mahendraganj Thana-Mahendraganj Embankment via Bazar.

(15)

Umlynsha-Rymbai Borghat Road via Ummat and Umlatdoh.

(16)

Pdeinshakap Jong U Shen Twah U Sdiah-Rongshongkum and Syndai Amjalong-Jong U Shen.

(17)

Pdeinshakap Borghat via Tarangblang.

(b)-(1)

Balat-Ryngku-Shella (Section I)

(2)

Missing link between Ampati and Purakhasia.

(3)

Dakubbazar-Dimapara via Mibonpara.

(4)

Mahendraganj to Embankment via Mahendraganj bazaar 1.84 Km.

(c)-(1)

Nongshken.

(2)

Mawsahew.

(3)

Dongar-Dombah.

(4)

Tarangblang.

(5)

Twah U Sdiah.

(6)

Siju (Phase II).

(d)-(1)

Nongskhen.

(2)

Donger-Dombah.

(3)

Twah U Sdiah Water Supply Schemes were taken up.

(e)-(1)

Tarangblang and Mawsahew. These Schemes are under scrutiny and investigation.

(2)

Siju Water Supply Scheme is awaiting financial sanction.

Shri H. Hadem :- In reply to 67(a), we find that there are 4 schemes. When will the Government start construction of the other 13 schemes, Sir ?

Shri Blooming B. Shallam Minister of State Border Area Development :-  As soon as we are ready to start them.

Taking over of the Shillong Meter Factory

Shri Upstar Kharbuli asked :- 

68

Will the Minister in charge of Power be pleased to state :- 

(a)

Whether the Meghalaya Electricity  Board have since taken over the Shillong Meter Factory ?

(b)

If so the present position of the Factory ?

(c)

Whether the Board propose to re open the Factory ?

(d)

If not why not ?

Shri Stanley d. D. Nichols Roy Minister in charge of Power replied :- 

68(a)

Yes

(b)

The Factory is not manufacturing any meters at the moment.

(c)

The matter will be examined.

(d)

In view of reply to question (c) above this question does not arise.

Shri H. Hadem :-  68(b) What for the taking over of the factory is meant by the Department.?

Shri S. D. D. Nichols Roy Minister of Power :-  I don't catch the question.

Mr. Speaker :-  I don't catch it either. The Government of Meghalaya have taken over the Shillong Meter Factory. The factory is not manufacturing any meter at the moment.

Shri H. Hadem :-  It means that it is not functioning at al. So what for Government have taken it over ?

Mr. Speaker :-  Why was it taken over. That was the question.

Shri S. D. D. Nichols Minister of Power :- Mr. Speaker Sir, the agreement between the Assam Government and the Meghalaya Government which was laid on the Table of the House envisages that all assets and liabilities, located in Meghalaya come over to the Meghalaya State Electricity Board and this factory is one of the physical assets.

Shri Maham Singh :-  What is the annual loss of this factory ?

Mr. Speaker :-  That is a new question. Let us pass on the next item. Mr. Lapang.

Shri D. D. Lapang :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, I beg to call the attention of the Minister supply under Rule 54 of the Rules of Procedure and conduct of Business in the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly to a news item published in the Khasi Weekly "Ka Pyrta U Riew Lum" of 14th February 1975 under the caption "JYNJAR SAT KI BRIEW HA MEGHALAYA KAMRUP BORDER". 

        Mr. Speaker Sir, it is really very unfortunate that besides  border disputes there is also harassment and inconvenience caused by the Government from the other side by posting the police guards who are preventing our people from going to the other side for trade and  business. This shows that the expression of friendliness and cooperation made by our Government  does not receive  the expected response from the other side. So, on this point Mr. Speaker Sir I would like to know what action has our Government taken to rescue the people in the border areas. Point No.2, I would like to know whether our Government has approached the Assam Government to avoid such harassment and inconvenience caused by that Government to our people residing in the border of the Kamrup. 

Shri Humphrey Hadem, :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, on a point of information and clarification. Whether under the call attention notice any conditions can  be made while making the statement ?

Mr. Speaker :- No these are not conditions but only clarification that he has sought for.

Shri E. Bareh Minister Supply :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir, the reported famine condition of the  people living in the Khasi Hills Kamrup border was reported to the Deputy commissioner, Khasi Hills District on the 10th  February 1975 by the Joint Secretary Khasi Hills District A.P.H.L.C. This was inquired into by the  'Subdivisional Officer Nongstoin who found that there was no famine in Kyrshai. Langpih Umbah and Nongspung areas. As such the situation did not  warrant rushing of relief measures to the people of the above areas. The people of these areas experienced  some difficulties for some time in bringing food commodities from the  nearest market which falls under Kamrup District as Assam Government had restricted movement of essential relaxed by the Assam Government and the people are now getting rice at Rs.2.75 per Kilogram and also the other essential commodities regularly.

       Mr. Speaker Sir, I may be allowed to read the report of the Subdivisional Officer, Nongstoin as it is.

"Subject :-  Enquiry report on the reported famine condition of Kyrshai Langpih area."

Reference :- To endorsement dated 11th February 1975 on the body latter dated 10th  February 1975 of the Joint Secretary Khasi Hills District A.P.H.L.C.

2.    Your W/T Massage dated 3rd March 1975.

        In inviting reference to your letter mentioned above I  have the honour to State that I had been to Kyrshai 6th and 7th March 1975 in connection with enquiry into the reported famine condition of the people in that area and to say that there is no famine condition and the situation does not warrant rushing of relief to those people.

        It may be mentioned that about a month ago the Assam Government had restricted the movement of essential commodities outside the State and the people found great difficulties in bringing the commodities from the bazars from Kamrup District as there is no bazar located in the Khasi Hills. In the source of time the restriction has been relaxed and the people could purchase sugar salt and even rice which is sold at Rs. 2.75 per kilogram. The people of the above area are mostly labourers of timber merchant and earn their livelihood as such. Some of them grow paddy of their own which supplements their daily requirement.

        I have been to the neighbouring village viz Nongspung and there is no complaint of any famine as the people are mostly engaged in timber business as labours.

        Further I has been earlier to Langpih i.e. on 28th February 1975 and I received no complaint of famine condition anywhere and that food stuff in the Langpih Bazars are available.

        Rajakhumai under Nongkhlaw Syiemship is no under this  subdivision so no comment can be made on this.

        It may be mentioned that Kyrshai and the neighbouring villages are isolated areas which could be approached only through Chayagoan in Kamrup District which is at a distance of about 18 miles the other alternative approach is from Rambrai which is at a distance of 25 miles on foot. In case the restriction by the Assam Government is really effective the people may face some difficulties in procuring foodstuffs from bazar fortunately this is not the case.

        In view of the fact that there is no road communication to these areas it would benefit the people if a road is made between Aradonga and Kyrshai so that the boundary disputes may be solved to a great extent these areas are rich in forest resources.

        Incidentally it may be mentioned that steps have been taken to ensure that the essential commodities at Government rates are made available to these people in future.

        The original petition sent with your letter under reference is returned here with ".

        As regards Rajakhumai village the Deputy Commissioner Khasi Hills informs that as the village Rajakhumai is located in the interior the Block Development Officers is reported will take some time as the B.D.O., Mairang has to proceeded on foot to investigate. However the Deputy Commissioner has confirmed that the B.D.O. Mairang informed him that no such alarming report of scarcity has been received. The B.D.O. Mairang is however proceeding to the place to investigate.

        With regard to providing relief measures to the people of the  State. Supply Department has no fund at its disposal except for payment of transport cost for supplies of essential commodities to the people living in the border areas of Bangladesh. Hence supply department has no action to take in this case but the Department will now ever make arrangement for supply of foodgrains required for the purpose on there question by other Department.

        With respect to posting of Police Force by the Assam Government the areas no mention has been made by the Deputy Commissioner Khasi Hills District in his report about the existence of the Police Force in the areas i.e. Kyrshai Langpih areas. The Police force if any may be those helped checking the inter State movement of essential commodities while the restriction on movement of essential commodities was in force.

Shri F. K. Mawlot :-  Sir, I rise to sound a word of caution...........

Mr. Speaker :-  I cannot allow a debate on this.

Shri F. K. Mawlot :-  I just want to raise a protest on one  point regarding there post given by the Subdivisional Officer as areas our just now by the Minister.

Shri H. Hadem :-  I would like  to raise a point of order that the rule does not allow any discussion  on the statement made by the Minister.

Mr. Speaker:-  The rule does not allow any discussion or even to protest like that. I would like the hon. Member to take recourse to some other rule or to have a discussion with the Minister in his Chamber I think that would be better.

        Let us pass on to the next item General discussion on the budget now. Mr. Maham Singh .You will get 14 minutes.

*Shri Maham Singh :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, I thank you for giving me this opportunity to participate in the general discussion of the budget. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is the forth Budget Speech that has been delivered by the Minister of Finance before this august House. Four years ago when we first met he presented his first budget speech. Mr. Speaker Sir, four years have passed if I remember aright the first budget speech that has been delivered by the Hon'ble Finance Minister was full of hope and confidence. Mr.  Speaker, Sir, in that he had stated that we would be able to build at least a progressive State in that it was stated  that we would be able to build a State self sufficient in respect of food and equal opportunity will be given to all people of the State in various fields of activities and we will be able to build up a prosperous State. But what do we finds today in the Budget Speech ? As has been pointed out by the hon. Member from Nongtalang the  situation is full of challenges. He finds that the situation as it exist today is full of challenges. It is a matter of deep regret to see that whatever schemes and plans that have been taken up by the Government during the last 4 years have been a total failure. Mr. Speaker Sir,  we have always to see whether a project taken up by the Government is correct or not, whether actually it would serve the best interest of the State  and the people of the State at large. Mr. Speaker Sir it would not be possible for me to deal with each and every subject but I would like  to touch only a few important points today. Now Sir in 1970-71 the total yield of food grains as envisaged was 1 lakhs 23 thousand and 7 hundred tonnes and at that time the Finance Minister assured that the food grains production would boost up by 4 per cent  in next few years. But what do we find in 1973-74 ? The total yield of the food grains production is only to the tune of 1 lakhs twenty five thousand tonnes only. Mr. Speaker, Sir, it appears that the production of foodgrains during these four years would be raised by 1000 tonnes. Now Mr. Speaker Sir, in agriculture crore of rupees has been spent nearly 2 crores this years for agriculture, and I believe during the last 4 years more than 10 crores had been spend for agriculture but there was no additional food production in spite of spending so much of money. In this connection, Mr. Speaker Sir, I would like to submit that here in this State of ours we do not suffer so much from flood, although it has been stated in the Budget Speech that the year 1974-75 had not been a favourable year for agriculture, and the blame was attributed to the unprecedented flood and  heavy rainfall. But Sir I would like to submit that our State compared to other States does not suffer so much from flood and I believe had there been correct schemes and had there been proper execution of the schemes, there would not have been any reason as to why our State should not be self-sufficient in respect of food. I believe it is not due to unprecedented flood not it is due to heavy rainfall that we are facing scarcity of foodgrains but what I feel is that it is due to human failure, it is the failure of the Government to undertake correct schemes. Mr. Speaker, Sir as you are aware, in the upland areas of the State we do not suffer so much from flood and I believe if during dry season we can supply water to the people and if we can take up at least extensive schemes for irrigation then I believe we will be able to produce more foodgrains that what we are producing today. Therefore, I would like to impress upon the Government that we should pay more and more attention to this aspect and to make further progress of our State in achieving self-sufficiency in respect of food and I would request the Government to pay more attention to this particular Department so that this State of ours will not have to go on begging for fond in future years.

        Mr. Speaker, Sir, there are many schemes that have been taken up by the Government but what I find, Sir, the schemes are very defective, some are very extravagant, actually they are more luxurious than productive. In this connection, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to refer to the project i.e. the Indo-Danish Project. In spite of our opposition, this project had been undertaken, and after many years of discussion this project has actually come into existence. We find 60 members of cows and 6 number of bulls have been imported from abroad. Now let us examine how far this project will actually be beneficial to our people. In this connection, I would like to submits that let us go behind many years and try to trace the history of the Upper Shillong Farm. Mr. Speaker, Sir, 30 years ago I remember there was a Director of Agriculture who was a very painstaking man and this Director of Agriculture did not stay in Shillong but he stayed in the Farm site and he imported very good bulls at that time. What do we find in those days in the Farm ? Actually the condition of this Farm at that time was really very very productive and it was a very good farm. There were cattle in this very farm which used to yield about 1 maund of milk daily. Then again, Sir, there were other cattle whose yield was about 20 to 40 seers of milk per day. Now this Farm has been of great advantage to the people living in Shillong, because this farm has got a breeding section of its own, and thereby the quality of cattle also has been improved to a great extent. We find that at that time there were no experts employed in t his farm. We find cattle from the firm had been taken to the various exhibitions and many of them are yielding 22 litres of milk daily. We have got also the first prize in the exhibition held recently in Delhi-this is mentioned in the Budget Speech itself, in the All-India Livestock Show held in November last to compete with livestock brought from other States advanced in animal husbandry. These are the types of cattle that we have today. Many of them give about 22 litres of milk to 25 litres per day. Now, Sir, the question is an to who looks after those cattle. Besides the experts, they were being attended by people who hardly get 200 rupees a month as pay. But yet they rear and look after those cattle satisfactorily. Mr. Speaker, Sir, let us examined this project which has been always discussed by many of us, that is the Indo-Danish Project. Now, Sir, I must submit that I have seen this farm with very good animals.  I believe that we can improve much better in the yield from this animals. But what is the yield from them in the past ? I had been there personally I find that each cow could give only 9 litres of milk daily much below the standard of the cattle that we find in and around Shillong. Mr. Speaker, Sir, there are cattle producing milk varying from 7 to 9 litres a day. I believe Sir, that in maintaining this project this Government has wasted a huge a mount of public funds. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I say that we must examine the cattle imported from abroad. I must submit that the Government has not been able to entrust them to the service of local experts or local officers. They have instead imported experts from abroad to look after these cattle. But what is the price and what is the cost of management of these cattle. Mr. Speaker, Sir, so far as my information goes, these experts were paid at Rs. 18,000 and another at Rs. 15,000 a month. That is for those two experts looking after those 60 number of cattle. As such , we have incurred an expenditure of about Rs. 40,000 per month it is more than twelve times the pay of our ministers. Of course, I do not grudge the payment of those people who are experts but to keep them permanently for looking after these cattle, I say that it is too uneconomic and too extravagant, not only that, but when these experts have to go out on tour, what do we find ? They have got an additional T.A. of Rs. 100. So, Sir, I think we better keep them here temporarily but not on a permanent basis. Because if we keep them permanently , we have to incur an expenditure of not less than Rs. 40,000 a month. Then again Sir, over and above this, what is the cost of feeding these cattle ? A sum of another Rs.30,000 per month would go to about Rs. 60,000 to Rs. 66,000 a month for how much Sir, ? For merely 3,000 litres of milk. In this way the cost of production from this Indo-Danish Project is not  less than Rs. 20 per litre of milk. If we sell it at a profit then it will be at Rs. 25 per litre. Now who each one of us, will drink milk at Rs. 25 per litre ? Not only that this Government has also opened up Seed Farms everywhere but the cost of production of 1 kg. of potato works out to Rs. 30 in many of the seed farms of this Government. So, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I must submit that what is being done now is very discouraging indeed.. I find that the local cattle has been discarded and these Indo-Danish cattle were being brought. But then Mr. Speaker, Sir, if our local cattle were being brought. But then Mr. Speaker, Sir, if our local cattle are discarded, then I say that it will be damaging and dangerous to the interest  of our local cattle breeders in our State. 

        Now Mr. Speaker Sir, I may come to Industries Department of the  Government Let us try to find out what actually has been the policy of the  Government that has been followed in respect of the various schemed that had  been taken up by this Industries Department. As I have told you Sir that we find in this Industries Department that instead of helping our local entrepreneurs in the field of industries, actually, Sir, no scope is offered to the local entrepreneurs to open up industries. But what happens and to who has the whole industries Department of this State been entrusted with the job ? It has practically been entrusted to the Meghalaya Industrial Department Corporation Ltd. Mr. Speaker, Sir,  we find that his M.I.D.C. had invested in a number of industries as stated also in the Budget Speech of our Finance Minister. A number of industries has been mentioned as having come up in this State of ours. It has been stated that apart from Associated Beverages and Meghalaya a Plywood. Komorrah Limestone Ltd., which are functioning utilisation of tezpata by the setting  up of the Distillation Centre, Meghalaya. Essential Oils and Chemicals at Mawshamok would also be taken up soon. Mr. Speaker Sir none of these companies that have been been coming up were offered tour local people. Now the other day the hon. Member from Cherra had mentioned that with regard to the industries to be set up in this State of ours  we have to go outside also to find out people to undertake industries. If I remember he has stated that one of the reasons given by him is that we need skilled hands to open up these industries. We need people of technical knowledge to open up these industries. Mr. Speaker, Sir, according to him our people are not capable of opening up any of such industries.  But I would differ with him in this regard,. It is necessary in industry to employ people with technical skill, and knowledge but it is another thing to own the industry. I remember one major industry that has been taken up in this State of ours and that is Cement Factory where I was incharge for many years and in which there were other tribal Directors, Before and after tak9ing up this project they never had any technical knowledge whatsoever. Mr. Speaker, Sir, we had employed people in this industry and we had brought qualified persons from outside the State to run this particular industry. But Sir, to own the industry as I said is one thing and the owners of the industry generally are not technical people. They are not the people who know how the project is run or how the things are manufactured in the industry there. Let us examined those industries that have been entered into co-laboration with the M.I.D.C. Mr. Speaker, Sir, we know they had invested more than 5  lakhs of rupees in the Komorrah Limestone Mining Company Ltd. Now Sir, what is the nature, what is the character of this undertaking. Does it need all the people who are actually highly qualified, highly skilled to run it ? Mr. Speaker, Sir, what is the function of this Company. It is only quarrying of limestone. But this quarrying of limestone has always been there, it has always been done. Since about three or four generations ago our people have taken up this particular trade and even now, many people are still working along the border extracting and exporting limestone to Bangladesh. It is necessary Mr. Speaker, Sir, for this Komorah Limestone Company to collaborate with the MIDC. Should the MIDC go all over the country or to Bangladesh and other places to find out people to enter into collaboration with them ? Even the Government itself can run this industry so it is not necessary and there is no reason why it should enter into collaboration with them. People in the border area are doing this particular type of trade, why should they enter into collaboration with other people from outside. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I believe this Government of ours will always consider that they cannot enter into collaboration with our own people because our tribal people are not capable of doing any trade. They may have that understanding that our own people will not be capable of doing this type of job which requires technical skill and know-how. Then again, Mr. Speaker, Sir even my family about eighty years ago was engaged in quarrying and trading of limestone. Even at that period of time we do not have to go to other places to look for collaboration with other people. And then now this Meghalaya Essential Oils and Chemicals Ltd. I know that there were some local people who had submitted scheme to the Government but Sir, their scheme has not been considered at all by the Government. To them it was told, that Government itself will take up the project and again that a licencse or permission of the Government not required to start the project although it involves lakhs of rupees. They were told any entrepreneur can open up such type of industry without coming to the Government. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would submit that when our local people tried to open an industry by finding their own ways and means in running or opening the project without approaching the Government for help, they do not get a chance whereas we find as soon as entrepreneurs from outside come, immediately they will be given a chance and also the MIDC will invest funds in collaboration with those people. Now, Sir, in this project they have invested 2.46 lakhs of rupees. Then again in both these Companies the Managing Directors and officers are appointed from outside. Then again Mr. Speaker, Sir, I find that the Government has invested lakhs and lakhs of rupees  in these projects which are not very technical in nature in collaboration with other people from outside. I would submit that whenever our own people approached the Industries Department for any project what answer they will give Mr. Speaker, Sir, Even in this Essential Oils and Chemicals the answer given by the Department is that "No we are not giving this project to anyone and Government itself will take up the project". Sir, I would submit that our local entrepreneurs have been deprived of the chance to start these projects. But Sir, the Government have only petty schemes for the local people, schemes like sewing machine, carpentry, blacksmithy are work costing only Rs. 480 or so have been given to the local people. But when it comes to 10,000 rupees or so the tribal people of Meghalaya are never allowed to take up such schemes. I would submit that this is a very dangerous policy of the Government which is of no help to our people. Even when some of ours educated youths apply for loan for their transport scheme, they are offered instead like sewing machine and all that. Mr. Speaker, Sir, even one lakhs of rupees is considered to be huge an amount to be given to our local people. So Mr. Speaker, Sir, I find that we are raising a generation of tailors and carpenters.

Mr. Speaker :-  You mean to say unskilled tailors.

Shri Maham  Singh :-  Yes Mr. Speaker Sir, but then I find also Mr. Speaker Sir, a little while ago there was a  question with regard to the Meter Factory I  have forgotten where then it was mentioned somewhere that they are looking for entrepreneurs to come up with a  viable scheme for meter factory. This is what has been mentioned in the implementation of the development schemes. It is proposed to take over the meter factory  of the State Electricity Board which is lying idle at present die to uneconomic working.  Discussions were being held with the entrepreneurs for viable scheme I think I have the scheme. I will ask the local entrepreneurs to submit the scheme and I hope it will be given due consideration by the Government. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I  hope also they will enter into a collaboration with this local entrepreneurs as they are doing also with the  people from outside our State, because why Mr. Speaker, Sir, I find that in regard to the essential oil we leave out the tribal people who submitted the scheme it may be that the Government considered that these tribal people are not in a position to organise such a scheme. But then what about the local people who are non tribals who have submitted the scheme for Meghalaya Essentials Oils and Chemicals. Their case also has not been considered. So are we following a policy that is beneficial to the people of the State and  especially to the people of this area ? Therefore I would submit Mr. Speaker, Sir that the Government must look back and must change it approach if actually they want that the people of the State should progress economically and financially. Now Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is not only discrimination in the field of opening up of Industries that actually the Government has been following but than another point which in the next Budget Speech will be full of more challenges. Mr. Speaker, Sir, will be if the Government does no apply its mind to all the planed and schemes that have been taken up by the Government agencies and if it does not try to remove the defects the in the scheme. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would submit that the Government should also give up the practice of favoritism and nepotism of actually we are to achieve rapid advancement of our State. Now the other day. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I had mentioned  and instance of the supply of paints, but I will come to it later on. I will come to another instance. The purchase of surgical instruments and other materials for supply to the Government Hospital Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would submit that with regard to the purchase of these surgical instruments, there is also a local firm that has started production of all these surgical instruments and materials. Now this form has been produced very good instruments in  many respect and most of the instruments that have been produced by this local firm, are all of much more superior quality than the instruments that  have been produce by the firms from  outside. Now for the purchase of these surgical instruments and other materials the Government have got a Board to examine the  tenders and quotation of different contractors. They examined the an according to the  quality and price they will place the order from the different firms. Now purchase Board for the purchase of these surgical instruments and other materials for supply to the Government  Hospitals was made on the 6th February 1975. Mr. Speaker  Sir, only very recently and this transaction is over lakhs of rupees. They had examined the quality and also had examined the price that is given by different firms. They had come to a finding for he supply  of these materials which order to be placed with which firm. But then we find that one bright day, the Secretary over ruled what has been decided by the Purchase Board.

(Interruption Voices Shame Shame)

        The Secretary of the Government of the Medical Department had been given the authority to over rule the purchase Board by canceling all the findings of this  Purchase Board. Mr. Speaker Sir, he had cancelled the order that was placed with the local firm and had.......

Mr. Speaker :-   Under what provision can a Secretary over rule the findings of the  Purchase Board.?

Shri Maham Singh :-  That  was the Government who gave  him the authority, otherwise how the Secretary will dare for  such a thing flouting the decision of the Purchase Board (Voices Shame ..Shame) if no authority has been given by the Government I had said that there is discrimination inn the setting up of industries. Here also in the purchase of this materials the orders that were to be placed with the local firm have been cancelled and given to the  Assam Surgical, Mr. Speaker, Sir. Then I  would submit also on what cost the cost of one material is at least Rs. 17 quoted by the firm but it has been given to the form which has quoted for the same for more than Rs. 87. If these instruments are to be supplied by that firm (Bell rang )

Mr. Speaker :-  You have two minutes more.

Shri Maham Singh :-  Now Mr. Speaker, Sir with regard the supply of the paints there has been a discussion also in the statement that has been given the Chief Minister himself It was not at the instance of the tenderer and the suppliers with whom orders had been placed that actually this Mahavir Paint had been given also some of the contract to supply the paint but then the other day I had ofcourse reminded that the circumstances leading to the placing of the orders may be placed on the Table of the House so that  we may know for a fact. Mr. Speaker, Sir, because they have got all the papers and documents. So I would  submits, Mr. Speaker, Sir, If we actually want a rapid advancement of our State  then in that case we should be free from favouritism and corruption with these few words Sir I resume my seat.

Mr. Speaker :- Mr. Mylliemngap. You will get 20 Minutes. 

Shri G. Mylliemngap : - Mr. Speaker Sir, while associating myself with the budget discussion, first of all I extend my congratulation to the Finance Minister that in spite of many limitations and inflationary situation obtaining in the country and the worlds he has been able to present a Budget with a deficit of Rs. 86.20 lakhs at the close of this years plus a deficit Rs. 11.79 lakhs which was the opening balance of the Budget. But my humble submission, Mr. Speaker, Sir, is that I have made a little observation that there is a short fall in revenue receipts against State Excise and in the year 1974-75 the receipt was Rs. 22.43.- lakhs and  in 1975-76 it is Rs. 20.31. lakhs. Mr. Speaker Sir I beg to submit that this is an important source of revenue of our State and recently we have also empowered the Department to tax even liquor to one consumed by the Jawans and also the Government has tried to implement a new approach in this respect by opening more licensed Bars. But Mr. Speaker Sir It is unfortunate that in spite of all these efforts, the receipt against this particular source of income is estimated to be less the and what it was last years. Mr. Speaker, Sir, most probably, I feel that the situation  has warranted the Department to review the policy and find out ways and means which will be more conducive to sour society keeping in mind that the revenue should not be very  much low also. There is also another shortfall Mr. Speaker Sir, against the receipt from goods and  Passengers Tax. Last year it was Rs. 9.67 lakhs and this year it has gone down to Rs. 8.60 lakhs. In this respect also we have heard white a lot of complaints from bus owners truck owners and other vehicles owners for paying high taxes on their vehicles especially,, Goods and passengers Tax. But I don't understand Mr. Speaker, Sir, in  spite of all these why the revenue instead o going up is going down. There may be some technical difficulties for this the Department will know better or there may be some slackness in respect of assessment and recoveries of this particular tax. Therefore I feel that the Department which collects this particular source of income should also be up and doing to see that the income which we are deriving from this particular source will be augmented.

            The next point which I want to touch Mr. Speaker, Sir, is taxes on minerals. It is commonly known to the hon. Members of this august House that we are exploiting coal in Khasi and Jaintia Hills quite a huge quantity. And according to my information annually we are transporting about 40.000 tonnes of coal outside the State and it is also replied to one of the question of the hon. Member from Nongtalang that the Jaintia Hills District; Council is authorised to realise Rs 2 per tonne of coal that is being exported from Jaintia Hills. It is also a fact that this coal which we are exploiting in our district cannot be taken out of the State unless a movement permit is given by the State Government. In issuing a movement permit  is given by the State  Government. In issuing a movement permit the State has to render a certain service to financial taxes on minerals for which a movement permit is  granted. That of course is besides the taxes and duties levied by the Central Government.

        Now coming to the policy of the Government and the budget allocation Mr. Speaker Sir three years ago our Government pledged to eradicate the PID i.e. poverty ignorance and disease. But now Mr. Speaker, Sir with this stereo-typed budget which we have been noticing from year to year. I feel that actually we have not yet made a direct attack on these three fronts. To overcome these enemies of our people we have to plan out programmes objectives and not by stereo type of  programme which we have inherited from the then Government of Assam o make a direct attack on poverty. Mr. Speaker Sir I feel that there is one weapon out of many by which we  can make an attack on  this particular front and that is through cooperative societies. To make an attack on this particular front of poverty I feel that the Government should implement the master plan recommended buy the Reserve Bank of India immediately with a time bound programme also that we can reshape the cooperative organisation in our State. Side by side this cooperative education is very important and  we  can channelise the funds for  cooperative education through the State cooperative banks to organise training seminar and other extension services and for this I urge upon the  Government through you Sir to allot some fund for cooperative education . Further to extends financial assistance to farmer at liberal terms and conditions and side by side with that we have also to  review cooperative  laws and empower the Registrar of the cooperative societies to take all action for compulsory amalgamation of one cooperative societies Punjab pattern and to augment the deposits of the State Cooperative banks I urge upon the Government to use its influence on all Government undertakings. Over and above this as the Government has constituted consultative committees for other department  I think it is proper also to have a consultative committee for cooperation.

        Next Mr. Speaker, Sir to attach ignorance is a most difficult task and the weapon which we are having now is very very weak. Education as you have know Mr. Speaker Sir as suggested at present is a delicate subject which has created lot of divided opinion and many members have touched and spoken the subject. I fully sympathies with the cause of teacher both in schools and colleges. But may I put word of caution to  this Government to be very careful in tackling this particular subjects. Mr. Speaker Sir, irrespect of health as it is now, I  have see that T B is very common in our State. In my own constituency not less that 10 people this year have been attacked by this disease and I feel that the Government should take immediate steps to make a survey and also give mass inoculation to fight against this disease.

Mr. Speaker :- Well it is said T. B. is the disease of the poor.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :-  Yes Mr. Speaker, Sir we the have to fight against this disease very hard. besides poverty disease also Joins hand with it. Therefore it is the special responsibility of the Government to make an attack on these fronts. Therefore Mr. Speaker, Sir, since you have given an indication that I should sit down with this minor observation, I am resuming my seat.

Mr. Speaker :-  Now the last hon. Member who would participates is Mr. Jackman Marak. He will have only 8 to 9 minutes in order to give time to the Finance Minister for his reply.

Shri Jackman Marak :-  Mr. Speaker Sir,..........(interruption)

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  I think Mr. Francis Mawlot has a right to  speak and our quota......

Mr. Speaker :-  It is not a question of quota. In the Business Advisory committee nobody suggested that to me but in the past of course, we have decided that so much time should be given to different groups. But this time I am abiding by the convention that I should consult the whips. So whoever catches the eye of the Speaker gets the right to speak.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  But Mr. Speaker Sir, Mr. Mawlot was to speak.

Mr. Speaker :- But Mr. Mawlot had forgone his chance he had given his time to Mr. Syiemiong .

Shri Francis K Mawlot :-  Mr. Speaker Sir I would now request you to allow me.

Mr. Speaker :-  You will have plenty of time during the cut motions as you have submitted a numbers of cut motion. But if you insist I cannot deprive you of the right to speak .

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :-  I am grateful that you will allow me to speak.

Mr. Speaker :-  Mr. Jackman Marak will you surrender your time in favour of Mr. Mawlot ?

Shri Jackman Marak :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, since you have already given me a chance I want to speak now.

Mr. Speaker :-  Very well but I will give you only 7 minutes giving me the opportunity to speak.

Mr. Speaker :-  It is your right. You should not thank me.

Shri Jackman Marak :-  First of all Mr. Speaker Sir, I want to dwell on the border area problem but what to speak about the border area ? There are so many problems. But I will speak only on one or two points on the economy of the border people because the Meghalaya Government is going to develop the b order area. But Sir, according to the budget the schemes which are mentioned in the Budget for 1975-76 should be started very soon so that the people of the border area...............

Mr. Speaker :-  These are the suggestion of the ruling party. You should have taken full advantage of meeting the Minister.

Shri Jackman Marak :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, the point is that at the time of the influx of the Bangladesh refuges the problem of land compensation arose and I have got the assurance of the Meghalaya Government here. I will read it out now. Page 4 paragraphs 3, 7th line "Steps have been taken to clear these pending bills as early as possible. Some cases are also pending in the court. Cases of payment of during the hostilities in 1971 are being processed with the Government of India and steps are being taken to expedite finalisation". Mr. Speaker Sir, this is one of the problems that the border people are facing since 1971. So Sir it is my suggestion to the Government to see that these difficulties of the border people are ironed cut.

        The other point it on education. Sir, we are very glad that the Government of India has agreed for providing financial assistance for the establishment of residential schools so that the children of the shifting population  can get the chance in schools. We know that two residential schools are going to be established in the Simsaggiri Subdivision. So Sir, in this connection, one residential school should also be established in Tura South Division.

        I now come to development. Mr. Speaker Sir, since 1956 or 1958 so far my knowledge goes  some parts of one Elaka are within the Dambuk Aga and some parts of (1-6) within Chokpot Blocks. We call this Laskar Elaka. Before it is known as one six Elaka and the people in this Elaka are no getting any facilities available to Dambuk AgaBlock. Moreover Sir this Chokpot Block also cannot extend any facilities to the  people of the one six Elaka. So according to the division between the Simsanggiri Subdivision and Tura South Division. So this Elaka should be taken goes under the name of Tura Division. So this Elakas should be taken immediately to the Tura South Division. I heard that the Deputy Commissioner of Garo Hills had already recorded this but uptill now we have not  received  any information from the Deputy Commissioner (Bell rang)..........

        One minute Sir Regarding Transport Department I would like to point out here that we have not seen any bus for border areas one or two buses are running from Tura to border areas. But here in Shillong we find there are as many as 25 buses and probably this morning I find more  than 25 buses are being kept here in Shillong Why ? I urge upon the Government that at least some more buses should be given for the border areas both for the border areas both for fair and rough weather.

Mr. Speaker :-  Mr. Jackman Marak  I find you have got so many suggestion only. So I would request you to discuss all these things with Consultative Committees or you may even have a discussion with the Ministers concerned. Because it is the hon. Members on my left whom have got free excess to put so many suggestion inside the House. Mr. Francis K. Mawlot  ?

Shri Francis K Mawlot :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, first of all I would like to express my sorrow on the appearance of a deficit budget to the  under of Rs. 97.99. lakhs. The second paragraph of the Budget speech itself mentions with that hopeful headline of "Corrective Measures". Well Mr. Speaker, Sir, actually if we are to go on with a deficit to the tune of Rs. 97.99 lakhs, Government should have come forward with something very important under this Corrective Measures towards eliminating or minimizing the deficit amount. But there is nothing mentioned  ore sincerely proposed to minimise the deficit. Mr. Speaker  Sir if we are to correct our losses or if we are to minimise the deficit and raise then State economy we should find out ways and means to develop our State and the people living in the State. That the deficit would be minimised, I would like to say that it will be possible only by establishing new employment avenue like setting up of different industries for which raw materials are  abundantly available in the State or to create some other avenues where by we can give employment to our people. This will also raise the per capita income of the people of the State. I have going through the fifth Plan draft proposal and it is mentioned there that the Government proposes to raise the per capita income from Rs. 327 to Rs. 538 or something like that. But I am afraid unless the Government come forward with a new spirit and unless it decided to re-organise and re-orient all the Department this proposal or this aim of achieving the target of per capita income to the tune of Rs. 538. or so will remain a cry in wilderness. Mr. Speaker Sir, the other day the Hon'ble Minister incharge of District Council Affairs has told the House that the Government would not be able to release grants in time because the District Councils has failed to furnish the utilisation certificates. Mr.  Speaker Sir as stated by the hon. Member from the Pariong the District  Council of Khasi Hills had submitted the utilisation certificates in time . Many of the hon .Members have spoken o n this and they have expressed their feelings for the failure of the Government to apply the salaries of the teachers of the Lower Primary Schools. Mr. Speaker Sir, the amount of pay for L. P. School  teacher for three months during the periods of 1969-70 had not yet been paid to the District Council for disbursement. Although the leader of the House last year .....

Mr. Speaker :- In 1969-70 Meghalaya had not come into existence.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :- Well Mr. Speaker Sir, whether Meghalaya came into existence or not al the liabilities which the Government of Assam had not been able to pay to the District Council should be adjusted it is the duty of this Government to look into the matter and if necessary to regularise the amount with the Government  of Assam, later on. Mr. Sparker, Sir, as I said last years the leader of the House stated that some amount was advanced by this Government to the District Council for the salaries of the teachers. Actually so far my information goes the amount which the District Council received was the so meagre that it was not sufficient even for payment to the staff in  the District Council not to speak of paying the salaries o the teachers Moreover nothing was mentioned in the sanctioning letter to the effect that the amount is for payment of salaried of the teachers. Mr. Speaker Sir, I do not know whether this Government have completely neglected the teachers. If we are to develop our State first of all we must improve the lot of the teachers and we must pay more attention to Education Department.

        Mr. Speaker, Sir, another things as the hon. member from Pariong has mentioned is about the dues to be paid to the District Councils.

   Mr. Speaker :-  I thought you will say something new but it appears you just repeating the same what the other hon. Members have already stated.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :-  Sir I am not just repeating : I am saying all these things as an introduction. There is a huge amount still pending to be paid by the Government to the District Councils in regard to the share on major minerals.. That amount comes to the tune of Rs. 22,22,864.05. This figure is exclusively for the period from the 1971 to 1973 living aside that part of the period left by the Government of Assam and also the amount for 1974-75. So Mr. Speaker Sir if we are to run the administration smoothly and if we expect each and every one to work with the sincere spirit ad for the benefit of the Country and lot for the benefit of his own we  should ourselves set the example first (Bell rang).

        Only then we can ask other to work hard. Mr. Speaker Sir, only one more point which I want to add and that is regarding the Government Press. All of the officers that were taken over since the Government of Meghalaya came into existence are upto the mark . I do not know whether the Minister in charge of  Printing and Stationary had ever entered the Government Press or not. But anyone who goes there would not be able to stand even for the minutes due to the stinking smell and nasty surroundings. So far my knowledge goes about inner persons the employees of the Government Press are suffering from Cancer and T. B. because of the bad conditions prevailing there. With these few words Sir I resume my seat.

Mr. Speaker ;-  In fact I have received a notice from Shri S. D. Khongwir that the desires to speak today. But I am not sure if he can finish before 11.30 AM because I have fixed the time for discussion up to 11.30 A.M. before the Minister in charge of Finance will reply to the debate.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, I do not have anything to say at this juncture.

Mr. Speaker :-  The House adjourned till it meets again at 11.15. A. M.  when we will hear the reply from the Finance Minister.

The House resembled at 11.15 a.m. after tea break with the Speaker in the Chair.

Mr. Speaker :-  Now the Finance Minister to reply to the budget discussion.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister of Finance) :- Mr. Speaker Sir, at the outset I would like to express my appreciation and happiness at the rising standard of debate and discussion inside this House from year to year. In this Session during the Budget discussion I have been sitting constructive and more well informed discussion I have been sitting here and listening with threat interest and pleasant surprise at the realistic constructive and more well informed discussion from al sections of the House. In is indeed a happy augury to our State, Mr. Speaker, Sir, and I have the hope that with this general trend upward in the House, we in Meghalaya will indeed do very well in the democratic parliamentary form of democracy.

Mr. Speaker :-  We have already done very well.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Finance Minister :- We will improve further  Mr. Speaker Sir, and with this keen interest and seriousness in which the hon., Members have shown during the discussion in this Budget. I have no doubts that the objectives and programmes that we have laid down for the development of our State would receive an equally active support and cooperation from al the hon. Member of this House. Sir most of the suggestion most of the observations and the information do not call for my reply. In fact they were noted down by myself and my colleagues and also by the officers concerned and they are being considered and they will be acted upon as far practicable. Therefore Sir Would request all the hon. Members no to mind if some of the observation and suggestions are not being replied to during the course of my reply because suggestions comments and observations which are accepted need no reply. They will be simply acted upon as far as discussion of the Budget is the complete agreement from all the members of this House on the policy and programme laid down for the development of the State. For example the complete agreement and support on the priorities being given to agriculture. I would not claim any credit for the Government for this general support but I would  attribute this success to the peculiar character of the people of Meghalaya the robust since of realism the simplicity and the rapport that exist among all the people in the State with a pragmatic approach to the problems of the State that would give no room for controversy. Unlike the abstracts ideas on various projects we may see else where we have adopted here simply one policy the policy of approaching every problem with a sense of realism and with pragmatism.

        Sir, before I discuss on the various points raised in the debate, I would again reiterate that there are so many points and suggestions that may not be necessary to discuss as we have noted them and most of them are being accepted and will be considered and acted upon on development and administration of the State. First of all, Sir I would like to discuss about the essential aspect of this Budget. Many hon. Members are very much concerned about the big deficit of Rs. 97.99 lakhs and I feel the we need to have a thorough understanding of the  reason and the factors responsible. And the factors responsible for this deficit are (i) the new factors of the Government having been cast with the burden of implementation of the Pay Commission recommendations. Apart from the  increase in the Dearness Allowances which we may have to  bear in the coming years, the burden of pay including  the arrears from January 1973 due to the increase of pay of various categories of Government employment would amount to more than one crores of rupees. This is alone as the hon. Members will see would have covered the deficit of Rs, 97. lakhs. Then we would not have had this deficit even with this big additional  burden as a result of the implementation of the Pay Commission recommendations had we been allowed to have market borrowings at the level of the current years as already mentioned in the  speech that is Rs. 3.87 crores. Now the Government of India has reduced the level to Rs. 2.20 crores. Therefore if we had just been allowed the  current years level of borrowings this deficit would have been wiped out inspite of the big additional burden arising out of implementation of the Pay commission recommendations. Therefore looking at these factors I hope that the question that we have taken up with the Government of India in the Planning Commission about the need to maintain the level of borrowings at the current year's level may be more fruitful, and that is one way perhaps that we may be able to wipe out or to reduce the deficit. Another aspect also is there that we have not yet have a final settlement with the Planning Commission, so far as the need for administrative buildings is concerned. We have now a change of budgeting arising out of the Finance Commission recommendations that the administrative building which used to be financed from the normal budget before are now to be financed out of the plan and this aspect of the matter has not been fully gone into by the Planning Commission. We are preparing the figures and we are pressing the Finance Commission for more allocation on respect of the expenditure that we will have to incur in the next financial year on account of administrative building including the building of police, the building for administrative offices in the Nongstoin headquarters and also Williamnagar headquarter and Nongpoh Administrative Unit headquarter and so on. Therefore when the Planning Commission will see these facts and figures we expect that sufficient funds will be allotted for this purpose and we hope that the deficit will be very much reduced or even wiped out at the close of the next years. 

        Next I would like to discuss  a very serious matter which is subject of great importance for this State as has been raised by the hon. Minister from Pariong. Mr. Hopingstone Lyngdoh. This is about the relationship between the State Government and the District Councils, I may quite  here a part of his speech. He said 'I would like also to refer to another  aspect of the matter in connection with the attitude of the Government towards the District councils" Further he stated, " The District councils are in fact the contributing agencies towards the the subjects which the  State deals with variety of development for peace and integrity of the  State " We fully agree and in fact thorough the Governor's Address we have repeatedly stressed the importance that the Government in this State placed on the District Councils their functions and their activities. We have stated that the Government will associate the District Councils with more and more  function for development. Therefore We are at one with at one with the hon. Members about the  importance of the  District Council as agencies for development in the State. In this connection we may note one fact of a great change when the Hills State of Meghalaya formed that the character of the District councils has naturally undergone change from merely protective and safeguarding character previously to the more important role now played by the District Council in the development and administration of the State. However in this connection I do not agree with the remarks of the  hon. Member Mr. Lyngdoh regarding attitude of the present Government in relation to the three District councils. He stated that the attitude of our Government towards the District councils is very unfriendly. He means the Khasi Hills District councils. Then he cited an instance of partiality and discrimination towards Jaintia Hills District Council I will give the facts and figures of this matter. In 1973 as against what Mr. Lyngdoh has stated about financial help to the District Council concerned, I may tell him that in 1973 the Khasi Hills District Council received Rs. 2.76 lakhs while Garo Hill District Council  nil and Jaintia Hills District Council Received 2 lakhs. The implication of the hon. Member it may be discrimination in his mind might be because of the different parties running the District councils. Here we have in 1973 the Garo Hills and Jaintia Hills District Councils run by one party and in Khasi Hills District Council by another different party. But the figure shows that Khasi Hills District Council has got Rs. 20.000. Garo Hills Rs. 2.00.000. Now in 1974. Khasi Hill received Rs. 2.00.000 Garo Hills Rs. 3.00.000 and Jaintia Hills Rs.. 1.00.000. These are advance the  ways and the means advance to help the District Councils to meet their day to day administration when they come to a financial difficulty. Then again, so far as development is concerned, the development funds given to the various District Councils during 1973-74 are like this. This Khasi Hills  District Council received Rs. 12.15 lakhs the Garo Hills District Council  received Rs. 11.12 lakhs during the same periods i.e. 1973-74 and the Jaintia Hills District Council received Rs. 4.59 lakhs. Well Sir if we look at these figures then no one will be in doubt that there is no discrimination at all in this respect. Sir therefore I would like to appeal to the hon. Members to cast away the apprehensions and misconceptions about the attitude of the Government. I may firmly State to this House that the policy adopted by this Government is  a policy of fairness. Government believe in this and is fully committed to the policy of fairness in dealing with all persons, with all organisation and with  all institutions. And I may add my humble experience and say that I have realised that it always pays for the individual for the family for the  Government or for the nation to be fair in dealing with others. Therefore, again I would appeal to the hon. Member that in Meghalaya let us have faith upon each other, let us maintain this report this understanding that we had not and let us believe more an more on this report this understanding and cooperation in all spheres of activities and relationship.

        Last time, Mr. Lyngdoh also has raised the  question about the due out of the shares accruing to the District Councils from various items like motor vehicles taxes royalty from major minerals. Now in this regard there were dues out of the shares according some of them are still pending right from 1965 during the Assam period some dues have been cleared by the Government of Assam till 1968-69. We are working out these shares and one thing I may assure the hon. Member that though the direct responsibility of the Government of Meghalaya would be to give the shares due  the period of the Meghalaya Government but the Government has accepted the responsibility and is ready to take the responsibility of the paying even the dues out of the shares accreting during the period before the Meghalaya Government came into being. We are now in the process of the sorting out the figures of various items and I hope we may be able to come to final figures soon and this will be settled. Some of the figures cited by the  hon. Member from Pariong about the advances that we  have given will be adjusted and  these dues will be finally settled in the near future. Now Sir all the figures that have been mentioned by Mr. Lyngdoh Specially on the questions of minor minerals seem not to be correct and highly exaggerated. He has mentioned that the figures of Rs. 43.24.995.63P due to Khasi Hills District Councils claim in this regard amounted only Rs. 15.00.567. There is a big difference. However this is matter of figures. it maybe a mistake but let us stud these figures more carefully. Again the hon. Member from Nongstoin Mr. Mawlot has mentioned about the shares due from royalty on major an minor minerals. he has put the figures at Rs. 22. lakhs this morning  . In fact we have gone into the figures available with the Department an we found that the arrears due to the Government on amount of royalty from major minerals up to date is only Rs. 15 lakhs . Now we have also know what will be the total amount that actually we will collect and the District councils shares will be not on the dues but on the actual collection. Therefore it will not certainly be Rs. 22. Lakhs not even Rs. 9. lakhs So, It may come very much below what  has Ben mentioned by the hon. Members because 60. per cent will be paid out of the total collection.

Shri H. S. Lyngdoh :- Mr. Speaker, Sir in fact the figures that have been mentioned do quoted have been found from the Department  concerning and the amount involved is upto 1974.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :- Mr. Speaker, Sir but it seems from the data collected that the figures are not correct. However I would like to say that it will not be so definite about it but we will now no work out the figures and we are in right earnest to work out the figures so far as the District Councils share is concerned.

        The next point that I would like to discuss is  one subject that may be more or less outside the general concern of the House of of the State Government i.e the North Eastern Hills University and since the hon.. members Mr. A Warjri has raise objection very strongly, I think it is necessary, Mr. Speaker Sir that I may be able to discuss about it a little . Now Mr. A Wajri had made certain very very critical remarks about the attitude and functions of this University with critical remark about the  attitude and functions of the University with regards to the relation with the local tribal people. Now Sir one fact that I may like to stress is that this University is a Central University of India. As a Central university it has in matter of appointment of lecturers of the lecturer to follow certain norms as laid down by the U.G.C. for example the lecturer of Central University should have a Ph.D. degree But Sir in this matter the tribal without Ph. D. degrees have been appointed in this University and there is even a little stretch in favourable of the tribal people and even the lecturers without Ph. D degree have been appointed an lecturers in this University. Over and above the University has taken up the programmes of training  by sending Meghalayan teachers for training to other parts of the country to attain  the necessary qualification. At present two teachers have been sent to Hyderabad University and one in the Department of Languages in the Delhi University . Now the hon., Member has also criticized the procedure of enrolment of the students. I would like to say that it is not true that the tribal  students were not admitted like others. In some classes Khasi  tribal student are in majority. Now in this regard I would like to mention that more than 60% of the entire administrative staff in the North Eastern Hill University are from Meghalaya. And then the hon. Member has also raised a question that other Universities in the country have not recognised this University including major ones like Calcutta, Punjab, Delhi and other Universities. Therefore, there is no question of recognition of this University.

        Sir, now I will come to agriculture. With the agreement and consensus or the policies and programmes of the Government almost every member who has participated in this discussion has spoke on this subjects and has made observations and suggestions and comments. And as stated earlier this does not call for the reply as they have been  noted during the course of the activities in the field. However Sir perhaps not seriously but by ways of criticism the hon. members from Nongtalang have a very very critical views point to the extent to say that if the funds allotted to the Agriculture department and the 'Community Development are given to each and every family of Meghalaya perhaps the economic condition of the State would have been better. I do not know how far he is sincere. The hon. member. Mr.. Maham Singh  this morning also made a very very critical remark on the performance of the Agriculture department in the rural areas. Sir let us see with a very objective mind and approach to the question of functioning and scope of development in this Department. The investment in the agricultural sector cannot be expected to have visible result immediately in a year or two. There are investment for economy, like investment for infrastructures and investment for education to the vas t masses of illiterates farmers. It is a most important subject and at the same time it is really a most difficult subject and it has a long drawn process with regard to the observation made by the hon. Member from Mawprem in that he criticized the soil development of this Department. He compared it to the other regions in the country and said that his region or Meghalaya area is more favourable for agricultural development. I do not know. But if we look  at the terrain of the hill regions of the State we have to consider the centuries of erosion due to unusual heavy rains and also due to the destructive jhum cultivation. How can we say that for food production this area is more favourable than other areas or regions in the country. Therefore, I would say that we have given certain thrust to the programme of the soil conservation because of these factors the centuries old erosions due to heavy rains the practice of jhumming, that has been very destructive to the soil and the weather condition. Therefore, we have gone in very strongly for soil conservation to change the mode of agricultural practices. From jhumming to the settled method of cultivation to the more technical way the more scientific way. At the same time we have the reforestation programme to cover the hills in the state in order to protect the  soil. With al these difficulties we cannot expect that in 4 years time we can bring in visible or big change in food production in the State. We have made certain progress and we will make better progress next year but for the natural calamities that has occurred last years in the form of flood and unprecedented rain in the State. Sir though I have stated that there was a general agreement as to the policies and programmes and priorities given in the State on one matter i.e. minor irrigation we have received quite an interesting note of caution or a different view from the hon. Member from Mylliem, Mr. Jormanik Syiem who has raised a some what pertinent point on the  the difficult of the present policy of taking up irrigation schemes departmentally for large areas or for groups of farmers so far as the terrain the difficultly land system in this District the slopes and the precipices are concerned. He has raised a question as to whether in this District we may not follow the old practices of giving aids or grants to enterprising farmer for land improvement. One thing I may say on this is that though there may be certain areas where these difficulties exist the District is not so informs and is some areas where these  not work very well. But we have taken in some schemes in the Khasi Hills where we will have very good irrigation work by the Department and at that also we have to strike a balance in order to  avoid the abuse of the irrigation grants given to individuals. It may happen that for one genuine enterprising farmer we may have 10 other farmer who are interested more in the money than in the real improvement of agriculture. However the Government will surely take this suggestion of Mr. Syiem into consideration and try to evolve a more practical approach in these matters which are really very very important. The hon. Members also while speaking on the subject had stressed the need for supply of adequate quantity of fertilizer in time. On this I may say that at present and also for the next years, we will have enough stock of fertilizer.

        Now Sir, the next subjects which I would like to discus is on education. Many hon. members of the House have participated on the subjects and their suggestions have been noted and are being considered. But I will only refer to some points for clarification. Now the allied subjects raised by the hon. member Shri. H.S. Lyngdoh and on which there is a consensus of feeling among other hon. Members also that there is always delay in giving the funds to the District Council for maintenance of Primary Schools. But I would say that in some cases there is always delay was due to the delay in submission of utilisation certificates. Now for this delay in submission of utilisation certificates it any not be correct to put the blame on the District councils because the present process of making utilisation certificated is a bit time consuming. Firstly they will be prepared by the District Councils then they have to be countersigned by the D. I. of schools  and it is difficult for the District councils to chase our Touring Officer. But now with the placing of the services of the Additional D. I. of Schools under the District Council we expect that the  Additional D. I. of School under District Council may be empowered to countersign the utilisation certifies. As such the questions of delay would cease and in future let us hope this complaint will no longer be there.

        Now Sir, the hon. Member from Nongpoh Shri D. D. Lapang has made a seemingly surprising statement that in most  cases the private schools deteriorate after the Government has taken them over. Well we always hear even some M.L.A also might have experienced that there is always a clamor from the public for taken over the private schools by the Government. But here we have heard a seemingly surprising statement from Mr. D. D Lapang who was I believe in the Education Service before the came to this august House that the private schools deteriorate after Government taking over. It may be true that there may be cases where such situation arises or occurs. We may consider two factors for such class. It may be in the first place due to the interest of the local people  the community there who may be more in favour of running their own private school than to surrender the schools to the Government. Secondly the teacher are not very willing to serve in the interior areas far away from the comfort and amenities of the town. While in private school the managing committee will appoint only the willing teacher from among the local talents who is interested in the welfare of the village the teachers appointed by the  Government may be from anywhere and may be transferred anywhere. So these may be the factors that need serious consideration and the Government  will give earnest consideration of the factors when we consider the question of provincialisation of private schools in the interior areas. One statement I forgot to make and that is regarding pay to the teachers. Mr. Mawlot stated this morning that there was an arrear die for 3 months to the teacher for the period 1969-70.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  For four months, Sir the amount to be paid is about 6 lakhs.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :- That is another information. Mr. Mawlot has said for three months during 1970.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :- That is a mistake. It is four months. I have enquired from the Department and they said that the amount was placed with the District Council and the District Council has not paid to the teachers.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance ;- So, Sir there is something quite serious and it is  quite possible. I have got another things on this. A letter was issued to the C. E. M. of Khasi Hills District Council by the Tribal Affairs Department dated 7th May 1973 where in an amount of Rs. 8. lakhs was given as loan and out of this Rs.8. lakhs Rs. 4 lakhs would be paid as arrears to the teachers. Any way this  requires investigation and the matter will be sorted out. Now Sir, another matter of equal importance was raised by the hon. Member Shri Shamsul Haque as well as Mr. Fuller Lyngdoh regarding the conditions obtaining in the Primary Schools especially in the interior areas. They stated that in many cases we have a single teacher for five classes ranging from Class A, B Classes 1, 2, and 3, and they have posed a question as to how are we going to create a base for proper education in such a situation. I may add that in these schools the number of pupils may be 50 to 60 the majority of who are tiny tots especially from Class A to Class B who draw more attention of the teachers to control and enforce discipline and them.

        This is rally quite a serious matter that we have to give proper consideration. Now, the Government have been seized of this problem and not only this Government but the Government of India also is alive to this problem. During the previous composite State of Assam we have a policy of ratio of one teacher to 40 students. Realising this problem this Government have taken up the with the Government of India vigorously during the last two or three years and we are glad that the Government of India had agreed that for Meghalaya we would have 1 to 25. We are going to implement this gradually with the funds available from the State and the Government of India. Let us hope for the best.

Shri D.N. Joshi :- Only for tribal primary school or for all primary school ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :- So far as this is concerned we consider the primary school first. The ratio of 1 to 25. Another step we are taking is regarding tiny tots from Class A to Class B children and that is through the establishment of Nursery Schools .We will have certain centres of Balwady Schools which will teach children and at the same time provide training for teachers to be sent to the  various Nursery Schools in the interior. Instead of giving grants perhaps it is better to  sent trained teacher to help the private fund nursery Schools. Now couple with the agriculture the hon. Member from Nongtalang has also bracketed community Development Programme when he said that all funds  channelised through the block agencies might be better distributed among the families. Sir I may again State the very objectives of this Government in matter of development of agriculture. Sir the agriculture Department and the block agencies are to create a climate for self generating economy of the State to provide for better seeds in rural areas to give better  technology. Therefore, if we look into this matter there is a time lag between investment and the result. So this matter there is a time lag between investment and the results. So I would again stress that this Department of Agriculture and the Block agencies are the agencies for development of the people ion rural areas, which call for greatest encouragement and cooperation from all sides of the House.

        Now Sir, coming to Industries the hon. Member from Mawprem Shri Maham Singh had brought out a very very serious allegation in various aspects of this Department. I would like to discuss this matter. He has generally criticised about the attitude of this Department of the Government with regard to local entrepreneurs and the people from outside and he has criticised that the Department or the Government outside and he had criticised that the Department or the Government had shown favourable attitude towards outside entrepreneurs or Industrialists. Sir it might appear so but then I would request the hon. Members to look at the question from the realistic assessment of the situation now obtaining in the State. For example he has referred to the Komorrah Limestone Mining Company Ltd. and asked why this company was being formed by outsiders and why it was not left to the people who have been running this firm to continue supply limestone to Bangladesh. Here is a remark of Shri Reidson Momin the other day when he said that traditional form of home  and cottage industries for supplying small quantity of limestone that can be exchanged in the border hats is not very good.

        It is destructive if we think in terms of supply in bulk in the international scale of commerce. Now this Komorrah Limestone Mining Company Ltd. was set up in order to implement the Joint Indo Bangladesh International Agreement to supply limestone to Bangladesh from Meghalaya to the tune of two lakh tonnes per annum. Anyway that traditional method of supplying small quantity is no longer considered expedient in the international export of limestone. People who are doing it can supply only a small amount and they have to continue for years to produce what can be produced by modern methods today's. They may take even 20 years to do what can be done in one year. We have to get people who work in scientific way we have to look also to the future of the State. Now this agreement will be for 20 years and it involves large sums of money required for some mechanised methods. I think it is fact that some limestone quarry mechanizes methods. I think it is a fact that some limestone quarry was done in that area and after taking  over of the quarry, it was found that it was not done in  a proper manner. Therefore, it to take up this work. But they will not continue after 5 years.

Shri Maham Singh :- My family in 1979 has sold seventy five thousand rupees worth of limes stone a day.

Shri B. B.  Lyngdoh :-  It is not for clarification now, but it is a debate,  Sir. Anyway this arrangement will continue for 5 years and after 5 years if we have done proper scientific work we may take over and then have our local people appointed. Sir again on this subjects that hon. Member has referred to Essential Oils Industry and stated that the local people had been rejected and [reference was given to people from outside. Now I may inform him that no scheme was  given to people from outside. I may inform him that no scheme was submitted by the local entrepreneurs to the MIDC, for the sophisticated essential oil production. Now the local people may manufactures crude oil including sophisticated refinery where crude oil will be further refined and the Government's policy is to allow the local people tribal people to purchase shares in this Joint Stock Company and they can participate in their enterprise and the tribal people  and other local entrepreneurs should approach the Government for industrial scheme. They will be given every facility to set up the Industry. Now the hon. Member has also mentioned about the Meghalaya Plywood Company that it is the outsiders who run the Industry. That is not so. It is set up by local Meghalayan promoters both tribals and non tribals. Now while we are on this question raised by the Hon. member from Mawprem who has also made one very very scathing remark on the Indo Danish Projects, I would like to say that this Indo Danish Project was a gift according to the agreement between the Government of Denmark and India. It is  gift of 60 cows and 6 bulls of high pedigree breed to the State of Meghalaya. Now the criticism about the expert which most of the hon. Member have expressed is uncalled for. These experts come here as a gift from the Danish Government to our project. There is no question of our State paying them. It is the Danish Government that pay them. So that criticism on pay and other expenses for these experts is not at  all justified and not based on facts. Now another point raised by Mr. Maham  Singh that these cows and cattle are not useful in that they are not producing the expected quantity of milk and so be would prefer to have indigenous cattle. Sir, I do not know whether he has studied the facts leading to production of milk by these cattle. But these cows which were brought here are now giving first birth and at their first birth they are not producing maximum yield of milk while at their second birth or third birth they will be producing increases quantity of milk. So the comparison on this question is not reasonable. They are producing and will be producing more quantity of milk as compared to the local cows. It is not so much a question of producing milk but it is a question of introducing better breed in the State. That is really the main object of the scheme to demonstrate to the people a better pedigree breed and to improve the pedigree of local cattle or indigenous cows. So many of the remarks on this question are really beside the point. It think it is a common understanding that the whole country and in our State, we are trying to raise the pedigree to raise better quality in all spheres including animal husbandry. So let us cooperate fully in this project.

Shri H. E. Pohshna :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir may we know from the Minister whether Government is going to conduct a family planning for the cattle ? Laughter..

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance ;-  The remark of the hon. Member is uncalled for at this hour. While we are on this the hon. Member from Mawprem had criticised the industrial policy of the State regarding the discrimination of non tribal when he said that they get only items like sewing machined and not big buses or trucks. I would say that under the Half a Million Job programme. II local tribals were included for private loans 9 for trucks and 2 for jeeps. One more case is sanctioned and is waiting the availability of the vehicles and it is not a fact that because they are not tribals they were not given the loan. The loan was given on are not tribals they were not given the loan.  The loan was given on certain principle which was accepted by the banks and some of the applicant could not meet the  the criteria and were not accepted by the banks an they were offered alternative schemes.

        Now Sir another matter that Shri Maham Singh has quoted about the figures that this Government has invested 10 crores of rupees in mater of development. I do not know where from the hon. member has collected the figures when we have only 5.25 crores. Before I discuss the points raised generally during the discussion I would refute another very serious charge made by the hon. Member from Mawprem about the purchase of surgical equipments in the hospital. He has stated that there was a Purchase Board and in last February they has a meeting.

Shri. Maham Singh :-  It was on the 6th of February.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  The purchase Board has examined the various prices and qualities of instruments and has decided upon certain local firms. Then suddenly one day the Secretary of the department has over rules the decision of the Purchase Board and has places different of orders. This is totally incorrect. The Chairman of the Purchase Board is the Secretary himself. So it means he over ruled himself which is not perhaps reasonable. Then again the proceedings of the Purchase Board never want to the Secretaries or to the Secretary. This matter is being sent direct to the Directorate because it is the Directorate which has got to place the order. In their  case the decision of the Purchase Board was in tact completely and it was acted upon cent per cent.

        Now coming to health. Many Members have participated and discussed the subject of health. We may reiterate that this Government also is full aware and fully convinced about the need to extend medical facilities and services the through out the State urban and rural. As stated earlier we have decided to have one Primary Health Centre in each of the 24 Blocks and in addition in deserving cases we care also having State dispensaries and Sub centres and so for the. Now on this matter the hon. Member from Mawkyrwat. Mr. Rowell Lyngdoh has raised the  question of private practice by the factors I may inform the hon.Member on this that the Asstt.  Surgeons in the Family Planning Programmer as well as in the Pasteur Institute  Shillong and a few others were given the non  practising allowance. All other categories of doctors are allowed private practice outside duty hours. On this subject of health many Member who have participated in the discussion are showing keen interesting the matter of water supply for the difference areas of the State. However as I have said the observation and the suggestions that had been voiced in the House have been noted and will be processed in the department . Only on the points that were raised by the hon. Members I would discuss only one point raised by Shri S. P Swer. from Sohra regarding lack of coordination between the  P.W.D. and P.H.E. Department in the matter of water supply to the Hospital. I may inform the Member that this is not a fact. There is complete coordination, but some difficulties have cropped up.  The estimated amount for the survey work has already been sanctioned by the P.W.D. and the survey has been conducted and completed Detailed estimates for that water supply scheme are under scrutiny. That is so far as Cherrapunjee Water Supply schemes is concerned has some apprehension that the Greater Shillong Water Supply may never materialise. On this I would like to assure the  hon. Member and the House that the  scheme sis being taken up and over are going ahead with it and this is being provided for from the plain money as well as borrowing from the L.I.C. Of course it is  only a matter of certan adjustment which might be made regarding the height of the dam in order to avoid submergence of the dwelling houses. Now the hon. Member from Nongpoh Mr. D. D. Lapang had referred to the Mawlai Water Supply Scheme and I think all the hon. Members are aware of the procession and demonstration that has come from Mawlai during the last Session if I  am not mistaken . Here I would like to elaborate a little about the scheme. This scheme was designed for one purpose. The Mawlai Water supply had existed for many years. Previously the supply of water to the distribution system of Barabazar from the reservoir at upper part of Barabazar. As the need for Barabazar became greater and greater the water went more and more towards Barabazar and less and less to the Mawlai distribution system. There were great difficulties for a period of about 5 or 6 years ago and therefore .Government has take up the scheme mainly for the purpose .

(At this stage the Speaker left the chamber and the Deputy Speaker  took the chair)

 of tapping an alternative source of water to the Mawlai distribution system. That scheme had been completed and I can assure the House that the scheme has provided enough water. more than enough to supply to the distribution system of Mawlai.  Therefore, we are a bit surprised at the  unique demonstration of this  question last December organized by certain leader from Mawlai. Defects shortages stoppage of water these are normal difficulties normal defects that our every where in the rural areas as well as in the urban areas and these  defective piped blockage  somewhere are the normal problems that are to be attended to and are being attended to from time to time in Shillong and everywhere. So there is no special problem that called for the demonstration from Mawlai in so far as this matter is concerned. And these problem like damaged pipes defective pipes etc, are being attended to in course of time. Sir before I come to another subject the border. I would  also  try to explain the contention of Mr. H.S. Lyngdoh  that there is contradiction between the Governor's Address and the Budget Speech. That is about Had a Million Jobs Programme. The Governor's Address had mentioned at page 17, para 20 like this "The Schemes under taken under Half -a - Million Jobs- Programme are being continued and it is expected that with more help from Nationalised banks these schemes could be made effective". The very words that these schemes of are being continued are mainly schemes connected with the Banks so far as fund is concerned. So the question of provision in the Budget does not arise. This is centrally sponsored scheme when the  Centre would provide funds then only the matter will come up for supplementary demands especially when this is a mater of financing from the banks. So there is no question of contradiction here.

Shri H. S. Lyngdoh :-  Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir in fact the Budget is a tentative provision for the years. So if the programmer of the Government is included in the Budget it must be provided in the Budget . But there in the Budget it is written nil., either from the State or Central Government.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Finance Minister :-  Therefore, I have said that it is a question of availability of funds from the banks and as such  10 per cent of the amount will be contributed by the Centre. Therefore, there is no points for making Budget provision in advance as we do not know what will be the Budget provision unless the Centre continues the advance.

Shri Winstone Syiemiong : -  May I get a clarification,. Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir ? Whether the Central Government has made a commitment that his scheme would be continued.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :- Let us read the Governor's Address regarding the scheme the words are- "the schemes undertaken under Half-a-Million Jobs Programme are being continued and will be continued". In so far as the Banks are concerned they  are financing the loan and the Government of India are earmarking the funds for this and whenever the State Government of India has advanced the  funds that will be in anticipation of the Government of India's financing the 10 per cent of the amount that will be recovered as 10 per cent contribution from the centre.

Shri. Winstone Syiemiong :-  I think it is not clear, I would like to have a categorical reply from the Finance Minster whether the governor when be made his Address has Government a commitment from the Central Government that there schemes will be continued and that the amount will continue in future.

Shri H.S. Lyngdoh :-  Sir, we learn that the Government of India will not continue these schemes during this year 1975-76.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  That is a different matter altogether. The Government of India has not said anything so far. Therefore we assume that the schemes are being continued and if the Government of India stop some where the schemes will stop. Therefore there is in question of contradiction here. It is really not correct to say that there is serious difficulty.

Shri Winstone Syiemiong :-  It means that the governor's Address is not certain about this schemes being continued.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Finance Minister :-  No these scheme are being continued. When the Government of India will stop at any time these schemes will also stop. It is so far as the State is concerned the schemes that have been undertaken will be continued. This is the policy of the Government and we do not propose to stop it.

Shri Winstone Syiemiong :- Then it is a doubtful; scheme.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Finance Minister :-  The schemes are being continued that is policy of the Government and we are not going to stop it, So I would like again to be more and more definite about the objectives since the matter was very very strongly criticised by the  Member from Mawprem regarding the Indo Danish Project. I would like to indicate a number of points on the objective of the schemes. Now this scheme is to improve the local stock through the pedigree imported to our State, Parisian origin.

        Number two to provide for training of officers for massive extension work for artificial insemination of the herd.

        Number three Education and provisional programme for the farmers.    

        Number four production and conservation of fodder and extension in the villages. There are the four main objectives .Therefore for the hon. Member to critice about the production of milk is not really very relevant to the objectives of the scheme.

Shri D. N. Joshi :-  If milk is not of  any importance then what is the use of artificial insemination.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  I have said at the beginning that even at the present stage of the first batch. these cows are giving increased yield of milk.

Shri Maham Singh :-  Mr. Deputy  Speaker Sir, I think the Hon'ble Finance Minister is not conversant with the local breeds.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  This is not the time for a debate. This may be taken up next year. Anyway these are the  facts, but we will have to engage an expert.

        Sir, now let me come to the last question. It is about the interest shown by the hon. Member again and again on this very very special problem that has faced the  State and that is the border problem. It is a fact that the border areas constitute more than 30 per cent of the area of the State and  not less than 22 per cent of the total population of the State. Since the partition this problem was created for the border areas and we have been for the last two or three years groping for ways and means to solve this problem,. We have taken up this problem very seriously and atleast this time  we have been  able to convince the Government of India and the planning commission about the magnitude of this problem and as stated by the chief Minister earlier the Planning Commission has agreed to increase the allocation of funds to about 65 lakhs of rupees for  this  coming year for border development and also has suggested a team to visit the border areas of Meghalaya to suggest ways and this coming year for border development and also has suggested a team to border areas of Meghalaya to suggest ways and means to solve the problem. Now Sir the solution to this problem has been suggested by many hon. Member from all areas and sections of the House. But it is really a very difficult problem. However we will make all efforts and the governments seriously considering the question of creation of a separate Department to deal with this problem and with the cooperation of all section of the House let us hope that we will be able to solve this problem. Now the hon. Member Shri M. Roy has suggested that the officers of this department should not be having their office  located in Shillong only. They should be located in the area itself. I may inform that at present the Department has nine  border area officers who are posted in the interior areas. Only the Director and Secretary of  the Department are of course at Shillong. We are trying also to recruit not only these nine border area officer but to recruit also one Special Officer to be attached to that Department to have an overall supervision be this particular department,

Mr. Deputy Speaker :-  Order, Order you have two minutes more now,

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh  Minister of Finance ;-  I am coming to the conclusion Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir

Shri A Warjri :-  Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir I would like to request the Minister to make a statement about the revised pay of college teachers.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh  Minster of Finance :-  Sir so far as this question is concerned the Government is convinced of the need of revision of  pay scale of the college teachers. Now as to the question raised about the  Government's intention and that attitude on the scale as recommended by the  U.G.C. I would  State that the? Government is studying seriously the various implication of this recommendation and will consider all the aspects and then come to a decision soon. So Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, I thank the hon. Members for the interest shown during the discussion on the programmes and policies of the Government and also for the cooperation and response to this discussion that we are having though we may have as human beings difference of option on different subjects, on different approach and so on.

Shri Hoping stone Lyngdoh :- Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, there are certain subjects like supply transport on which transport on which the Minister discussion in this House. It is  also then what is the use of our discussion in this House when the Minister does not want to give a reply .

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, as I have said at the very outset that there are criticisms, comments and observations made by so many hon. Members and al their observation, comments and suggestion ahve been noted down and necessary steps will be taken on al those matters.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, if we fo not get the reply to each remarks that we have made here, then what is thus of having all these discussions. Are we  here to make remarks unnecessarily.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh  Minister of Finance :- Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, If I have to reply to each and every question here then it will take three or four days. As I have already said that I gave been very careful to take down al the points raised by the  hon. Members and I think the most important and relevant procedure in my opinion will be as requested by the  hon. Member to reply to all the question- I think they don't really need a direct reply. But if the hon. Member will kindly write about that particular matter to the Department concerned perhaps we may give that reply in writing . That would be perhaps  better.

(At this stage the Speaker occupied the Chair)

Shri H. Hadem :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, what about the delay in getting the text books up till now ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance ;-  That is the same thing I have said that the point raised is being acted upon as far as practicable. It is really not possible to cover all the points raised in course of 2 hours.

Shri w. Syiemiong :-  May I ask the Finance Minister for some clarifications ? He has given the price index of  all India but I want to know what is the price index of the Meghalaya State because we must know this is order to corroborate with the actual condition.

Mr. Speaker :-  Mr. Syiemiong you have already raised that point while discussing the problem and the method by which computing of the figure is done.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minster of Finance :-  On that matter. Sir I regret that at present we have not been able to determine the price index in the State.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  Sir, I think at least some reference has been made to the supply of rice in Shillong and other essential commodities because we know that there is shortage of food stuffs in the State and in fact, I have raised this point with the Government .

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-  That is all the more reason why I have not replied in detail to this because about a week ago during the Governor's Address as the information that is given is in complete detail. So I do not want to repeat these things.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :-  During the debate on the governor's Address there was no reference. I have made a very clear reference to this, Now the supply of rice to the population of the 1.30.000 in Shillong is going on while according to the  number of ration cards maintained by the Department, the population comes to about 3.80.000 whereas the supply of rice to Nongstoin subdivision is only 2.0 bags per month while to Laban area alone the number of the bags is 1500 per month. they said that this is not a rice producing area while in the Bara Bazaar area.

Mr. Speaker :-  I understand your point very well and it is very much relevant because it concern the supply of rice but it is too much to expect the Finance  Minister to reply to everything . The Finance Minister has replied mostly on the question of policy regarding the implementation of the scheme. So far as that question is concerned you can raise or come forward with specific question to which the Minister in charge of Supply may reply in fuller detail if there is still time I may allow a short notice question.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Sir, another point which is a constitutional point amounts to privilege and dignity of the House. On that also he has not said anything. So what is the proposal of the Government in that regard ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Finance :-   In fact, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have discussed this matter.

Mr. Speaker :- I have already had a discussion with the Minister in charge of Law and I told him to summon the Advocate General to explain this matter on the floor of the House after voting on demands for grants  has been completed because we connot take another item on the dates fixed for voting on demands for grant.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minster of Finance :- Tentatively, we have fixed on the 1st of April the Advocate General will explain to us. Sir I will again reiterate my request to the hon. Member who have strong feelings about the need to get the clarifications, top kindly send their noted,

Shri W. Syiemiong :- Why and vice- versa?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh  Minster of Finance :- I have from my side considered the points raised. I think there are some point which p may not need clarification and then there are certain other points that. I  feel need clarification or replied. As such I have given replied or clarification. But as a human being it is very difficult to made an assessment as to exactly which point that the hon. Member considers more important and I on my point may consider other points as more important.

Mr. Speaker :- A give and take policy.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh  Minster of  Finance :- When you send us a note we will be able to decide sending you the clarification. In conclusion, I express my happiness at the interest taken by the hon. Members throughout the discussions and I hope we will be having more understanding and cooperation in times to come.

ADJOURNMENT

Mr. Speaker :- The House stands adjourned till 9.00 A. M. . on Friday the 21st March 1975.

R. T. Rymbai
Dated Shillong Secretary
the 19th March 1975 Meghalaya Legislative Assembly.