Proceedings of Meghalaya Legislative Assembly Assembled at 9.00 A. M. on Friday the 21st March 1975 in the Assembly Chamber Shillong.

Present :-  The Hon'ble Speaker in the Chair 8 Minister 3 Minister of State and 39 hon. Members.

Mr. Speaker:-  Let us begin the business of the day by taking up Starred Questions No.4.

STARRED QUESTIONS.

(To which oral replies were given)

Calling of Teacher for Improvement of Cherra Town Roads.

Shri S. P.  Swer :- 

*4

Will the Minister in charge of Public work Department be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether it is a fact that tenders for improvement of Cherra  Town roads were already called for ?

(b)

If so when will allotment of works be finalised ?

(c)

If not the reasons there of ?

Shri P Ripple Kyndiah Minister in charge of Public work  Department roads  and buildings etc, replied :- 

4 (a)

The tender for improvement of Cherra Town Road has already been called on 15th November, 1974.

(b)

Allotment is being made shortly.

(c)

Does not arise.

Shri S. P  Swer :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, whether the Government proposes to complete the work within this financial year.

Shri P.R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :-  Mr. Speaker Sir it is not possible.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  May we know the reason for delay ?    

Shri P.R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir, in such construction work little delay is unavoidable.

Mr. Speaker :- But the hon. Member wanted to know what are the reasons ?

Shri P.R. Kyndiah Minister of P.W.D. :- I require notice, Sir.

Mr. Speaker :-  Let us pass onto unstarred Question No. 69.

UNSTARRED QUESTIONS

(To which replies were laid on the table)

Urban Area Development Schemes

Shri D. Dethwelson Lapang  asked :-

69.

Will the Minister in charge of Town and Country Planning be pleased to state :-

(a)

The Urban area development schemes of the Government during 1972-73, 1973-74 and 1974-75 ?

(b)

The financial provision  for those schemes ?

(c)

The progress of the work at present ?

Shri P. Ripple Kyndiah Minster in charge of Town  and Country Planning replied :- 

69(a)

The list relating to Urban areas development schemes during the years 1972-73 1973-74, 1974-75 is placed on the Table of the House.

(b)

The financial provision are also indicated in the same list mentioned at (a) above.

(c)

The progress is generally satisfactory.

Wholesale Dealers in Foodgrains

Shri Manindra Rava asked :- 

70.

Will the Minister in charge of Supply be pleased to state :-

(a)

 The number of whole-sale dealers in food grains in the state (District wise) ?

(b)

The number of fair price shops in Garo Hills District ?

(c)

Whether Government envisage any special measure for amelioration of the difficulties of the flood affected people of Garo Hills ?

(d)

Is so the measure so proposed ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Food and Civil Supplies :-  replied :- 

70(a) 

The number of wholesale dealers in food grain in the State are as follow :-

Khasi Hills District

14

Garo Hills District

48

Jaintia Hills District

4

(b)

The number of Fair Price Shops in Garo Hills District is 368.

(c) & (d)

- Supply Department has no fund at its disposal for providing any relied measure to the people in the flood affected areas of the State. The Department will, however make arrangement for supply of food grain required for the purpose on requisition by other Department..

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, Question No. 70 (a) may we know the reasons for this vest difference between Khasi Hills and Garo Hills?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Supply :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, the appointment of wholesale dealers is being made by the  local officers, i.e. the Deputy commissioner of each District and it was done according to the local condition prevailing in that District.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- May we know whether Government proposes to increase the number in Khasi Hills District ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Supply :-  Mr. Speaker Sir it all depends upon the condition prevailing that the District which entirely rest with the Deputy commissioner of that District. 

Shri H. Hadem :-  May we know whether all these 14 wholesalers dealers in Khasi Hills are tribals.

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister Supply :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir, we have already laid a list of wholesale traders on the Table of the House since there is another  question in this connection.

Meghalayans still serving under the Government of Assam.

Shri Dolsing Lyngdoh asked :- 

71.

Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state :-

(a)

The number of Meghalayans appointed prior to 2nd April 1970 (categories wise) still serving with the Government of Assam ?

(b)

Whether there is any proposal with the Government to requisition all the Meghalayans serving with the Assam Government ?

(c)

Whether it is a fact that in some Departments requisition were made for non- Meghalayans for some category of post although there are many Meghalayans suitable for such posts.

Shri Williamson A Sangma Chief Minster replied :- 

71(a) - According to the information available with the Government there are 166 Meghalayan tribal employees appointed prior to 2nd April 1970. still serving under the Government of Assam 34 of whom have already been requisitioned. The break ups category wise are given below :-

ASSAM SECRETARIAT

(1)- Superintendent 

1

(2)- U. D.  Assistant

78

(3)- L. D. Assistants

12

(4)- Peons

4

Total

95

II DIRECTORATE.

(1)- Superintendent

1

(2)- U. D. Assistant

17

(3)- Accountant

4

(4)- Accounts Assistant

3

(5)- Head Assistant

1

(6)- Peon

1

(7)- Driver

1

(8)- Mechanic

1

(9)- Copyholder

1

(10)- Compositors

2

(11)- Assistant Examiner, Local Accounts

1

(12)- Marketing Officer of Industries

1

(13)- Nurses

24

(14)- Health Assistants

3

(15)- Injectors

5

(16)- Media Maker

1

(17)- Under qualified Stenographer

1

(18)- Typist

3

Total 

71

.Grand total of I and II 166 employees.

(b)

Government propose to requisition the Meghalaya tribal employees still serving under the Government of Assam subject to availability of vacancies

(c)

Yes

Shri H. Hadem :-  71(c) may we know the reason why ?

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister ;-  Mr. Speaker Sir, for certain categories of jobs especially for technical jobs it is not always possible to get suitable persons from Meghalaya.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Speaker Sir, the question was whether it is fact that in some departments requisitions were made for  non-Meghalayans for some category of post although there are many Meghalayans suitable for such posts.

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister :-  It depends upon the  definition of the term Meghalayan. Whether the hon. Member means that the terms Meghalayan confines only to Khasis and Garos ?

Mr. Speaker :-  I think you have not got the point. The question is whether they are non- Meghalayan or Meghalayans and not tribal and non-tribal. The hon. Member wants to know whether it is a fact that in some Departments requisitions for non- Meghalayans have been made although there are suitable Meghalayans for those post.

Shri W.A. Sangma   Chief Minister :-  I will try to explain it depends upon the very intention of the Hon. member in putting this question. I would like to know whether he liked that the term Meghalayans should confine only to know whether he likes that the term Meghalayans should confine only to tribals i.e. Khasis and Garos or whether by Meghalayan he means al tribals and non-tribals who are permanent residents of Meghalaya.

Shri. H. Hadem :-  The question is very clear and the question of Khasis Garos or Jaintias does not arise. The question is whether they are Meghalayans or non Meghalayans. 

Mr. Speaker :- It appears that so far as question No. 71 (c) is concerned. the office did not read the question very carefully. Therefore I would request the Chief Minister to place the necessary information on the Table of the House to -morrow.

Milk Cows brought from Denmark under the Indo Danish Project.

Shri Dhruba Nath Joshi :-  asked,

72.

Will the Minister in charge of Animal Husbandry be pleased to state :- 

(a)

The number of milk cows brought from Denmark under the Indo Danish Projects ?

(b)

The number of these cows giving milk and the average yield per vow per day.

(c)

Whether it is a fact that the yield of some cows of local breed are better than that of the imported cows ?

(d)

Whether it is a fact that there are very highly paid foreign experts who are engaged in the Project ?

(e)

If so their pay per month ?

(f)

Whether it is a fact that none of these per sons are staying within the Farm site ?

(g)

If so, where are they staying. ?

(h)

Whether it is a fact that the Government are importing expensive special fittings for their residence from abroad ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Animal Husbandry replied :-

72(a)

No Milk cows were brought under the Indo Danish Project; only sixty heifers and six bulls were supplied under the project by the Danish  Government.

(b)

All these sixty heifers have already calved and fifty eight are now in milk

The average yield per cow is ten litres per days..

(c)

No.

(d) & (e)

There are two Danish Advisers as per agreement between the Government of India and the Government of Denmark .Since the Advisers are paid by the Danish authorities the information in regard to their pay is not available.

(f)

 No.

(g)

One is staying in Upper Shillong Farm, premises and the other Pinewood Hotel.

(h)

No.

Shri Humphrey Hadem :-  Question 72(b) May we know what does mean by milk cows and heifers ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Animal and Husbandry :-  The average yield pre cow is ten litres per day of those calves.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Does it mean other cows are yielding milk without calves ? laughter .

Mr. Speaker :-  Mr. Hadem you should have little common sense cows without calves mil . Now let us pass on to Unstarred Questions No. 73.

Terraced land replaying Jhum cultivation in Garo Hills 

Shri Singjan Sangma  asked ;- 

73.

Will the Minister in charge of soil conservation be pleased to state :-

(a)

The total acreage of land taken up terracing by the soil Conservation Department in the Garo Hills to replace jhum cultivation during the year 1973-74 ?

(b)

Total acreage proposed top be taken up during the year 1974-75 ?

(c)

The total area terraced during the year 1973-74 (Nokmas Akhing and Block Development wise) ?

(d)

The rate of terracing per metre fixed by the Government ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Agriculture and Soil conservation replied :- 

73(a)-463.53 Hectares.

(b)-850.00 Hectares.

(c)-463.53. Hectares.

A statement is placed on the table of the House.

(d)  -The full rate ranges from Rs. 850. per hectare to Rs. 2.000 per hectares depending on the percentage of slopes.

Shri S. P. Swer :- Mr. Speaker Sir, may we know whether the lands taken up by the Government for terracing belong to Government or to any individuals.

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Agriculture :-  We have already placed a list of the land owners Block wise on the table of the House since there is another question on this.

Mr. Speaker :-  Before, we proceed further, I would like to observe that it would be convenient to the House when a Minister has placed a list or a document on the table of the House be  should at least supply me with one copy of the same so that I can give a ruling on any particular issue.

Establishment of Administrative Units.

Shri Onward Leyswell Nongtdu asked :- 

74.

Will the chief Minister be pleased to state :- 

(a)

 Whether it is a fact that few Administrative Units are to be established in the State.

(b)

If so what are the Units proposed to be opened ?

(c)

Whether the Government takes into consideration the recommendations of the District Planning Boards in this respect ?

(d)

The criteria which the Government takes into consideration for the purpose of the establishment of administrative units

Shri Williamson A. Sangma  Chief Minister  replied :- 

74(a)

Yes

(b)

The matter is under consideration of Government.

(c)

The recommendations of officials and non-officials concerned are taken into consideration.

(d)

The criteria for establishment units are mainly administrative needs availability of trained man power public convenience communication facilities population and various other factors.

Meghalaya State Transport Buses plying in Shillong Jowai Routs. 

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna asked :- 

75.

Will the Minister in charge of Transport be pleased to state :- 

(a)

The number of Meghalaya State Transport Buses plying in the Shillong-Jowai Route during the months of December 1974, January 1975 and February 1975 ?

(b)

The number of trips performed by each and the total amount derived from each bus during the above months.

(c)

Whether it is a fact that ticket issued exceed the number of seats in the buses ?

(d)

Whether it is affect that overloading is allowed an ticket are issued to the overloaded passengers ?

Shri Darwin d. Pugh Minister of Transport replied :- 

(a)-(i)

In December 1974-17 Buses.

(ii)

In January 1975-13 Buses.

(iii)

In February 1975- 16 Buses.

(b)

 The statement is placed on the Table of the House.

(c)

At the Station of origin tickets are issued within the seating capacity of a vehicles. As per rules if en-routs to destination some seats are vacant road side passengers are allowed to board the bus in such  numbers as not to cause overloading. Conductors are instructed to issue ticket to such road side passengers. It may therefore transpire that the number of ticket issued at the stations of origin plus the number of tickets issued to road side passengers any exceed the numbers of seats in any bus.

(d)

Rules do not allow over loading in M.S.T.U.  buses. Hence the question of issue of tickets to overloaded passengers does not arise

Shri H. Hadem :-  75(c) whether overloading include passengers who are standing inside the bus ?

Shri D.D. Pugh Minister of Transport :- Very definitely,  Sir

Shri H. Hadem :- Why tickets were issued to those passengers standing inside the bus ?

Shri D. D. Pugh Minister of Transport :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir, if the hon. Member looks into the reply at (d), he would see that the meaning of that reply is that sale of ticket to overloaded passengers, if any, inside the bus or outside the bus- I mean those sitting on top of the bus in not permissible under the rules and the Government is not aware of any violation of the this rule.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Whether any local verification has been done for that purpose. ?

Shri D. D. Pugh Minister of Transport :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, this action had not been  requested for or demanded or suggested. Nevertheless very recently we have appointed five line Checkers and the Government is contemplating the possibilities of appointing flying checkers as well. Now with the appointment of flying checker we hope the rule will be strictly adhered.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Sir, since I have exceeded three questions.

Mr. Speaker :-  You have already crossed three.

Shri H. Hadem :-  That is what I wanted to say, that since I have crossed three, I have to come through to other procedure as I am not at all convinced with the reply.

Financing of SDFA/MAAL  by State Banks of India Garo Hills.

Shri Pritington Sangma asked :- 

76.

Will the Minister in charge of Agriculture be pleased to state :- 

(a)

Whether it is a fact that State Bank of India refuses to finance SFDA / MFAL Development Agency in Garo Hills.

(b)

If so the reason thereof.

(c)

If the reply to (a) be in the negative the reason why the schemes taken up are not successful ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Agriculture replied :-

76. (a)

State Bank of India has not been approached so far for financing the Small Farmers Marginal Farmers and Agricultural Labours Development Agency due to the reason that the State Bank of India operates within 10 Kms radius of its branch for such purposes and no branches within small Farmers Marginal Farmers and Agricultural Labourers Development Agency areas. Moreover the Meghalaya Co-operative Apex Banks has assured the financing of the schemes on obtaining State guarantee.

(b) & (c)

In view of (a) above do not arise.

Shri Pritington Sangma :- Sir, in view of the answer to 76)(a) may we know the financing agency ?    

Shri E. Bareh Minister of Agriculture :-  It is clear from the reply that the Meghalaya Cooperative Apex Bank is financing the schemes.

Shri Pritington Sangma :- May we know the reason why payments have not yet been made for construction of sheds for Piggery Farm in the Rongjeng C.D. Block ? 

Shri E. Bareh Minister of Agriculture :- I want notice for that question.

Investigation into the workings of Government Departments.

Shri D. Dethwelson Lapang asked :- 

77.

Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state :- 

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the Criminal Investigation Bureau was invited to investigate into working of certain Government Departments ?

(b)

If so when the what are those department ?

(c)

Whether the report has been received ?

Shri Williamson Sangma Chief Minister  replied :- 

77   (a)

No.

(b) & (c)

Do not arise.

Names of Rice wholesalers in the three Districts

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna asked :- 

78.

Will the Minister in charge of Supply be pleased to state :- 

(a)

The names of all the rice wholesalers in (i) Jaintia Hills District (ii) Khasi Hills District (iii) Garo Hills District ?

(b)

The total quantity of rice issued to each wholesaler during the years 1972-73, 1973-74, 1974-75 upto February 1975 ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Food and Civil Supplies replied :- 

78(a)

A statement is placed on the Table of the House.

(b)

A statement is placed on the Table of the House.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Sir, from the statement placed on the Table of the House in reply to 78(b) for 1973-74 it transpired that to Shri. B. Sharma 11.500 quintals of rice were issued per year against Shri J. Kyndiah who was issued 10.500 quintals Mahabir Trading Agency was issued 7,950 quintals and Mrs. Hilsida Phawa 5,500 quintals. Against tin 1974-75 Mr. Sarma was issued 12,100 quintals and Mr. Kyndiah 10,050 quintals Mahabir Trading Agency 9,450 quintals and then to Mrs. Phawa 8,700 quintals. May we know the reason why there was so much of difference in the quantity issued to these agencies ?

Mr. Speaker :-  Why there is a difference in the allotment of rice to these four wholesalers ?

Shri E. Bareh Minister of Food and Civil Supplies :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, it will Depends on the number of the Fair Price Shops allotted to each of the wholesalers and the  quantity issued was in conformity with that.

Mr. Speaker  :- So the quantity was decided according to the number of Fair Price Shop dealers under each of these four wholesalers.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Now, the difference in the quantity is because of the number of Fair Price Shops. My question is this. Why very few Fair Price Shops dealer have been placed under the local wholesalers ?

Shri E. Bareh Minister of Food and Civil Supplies :-  Mr. Speaker  Sir, that depends on the area. Under each area one wholesaler is placed incharge.

Shri H. Hadem :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, we know the number of  Fair Price Shops allotted to each of these wholesalers ?

Shri E. Bareh Minister of Food and civil Supplies :- I want notice for that question. 

Mr. Speaker :- This is an unstarred question and if you want to put any extra supplementary question which elaborate details it is really difficult on the part of the Minister to reply.

Construction of Shangpung Water Work

Shri Onward Leyswell Nongtdu asked :- 

79.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering  be pleased to state :-

(a)

Whether it is a fact that construction of Shangpung Water Works has bee stopped ?

(b)

If so when Government proposes to start reconstruction of the said water works ?

Shri Sandford K Mawlot Minister in charge of Public Health engineering replied :- 

79 (a) & (b)

 A temporary Water Supply Scheme was taken up in connection with the  Presbyterian Synod at Shangpung in March 1974.Supply of water was stopped after the meet was over. A decision on permanent Water Supply Scheme which is under scrutiny at present will be taken in due course.

Construction of dam across Waikhyrwi River.

Shri Onward Leyswell Nongtdu asked :- 

80.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering be pleased to state :- 

(a)

Whether it is a fact that construction of a dam across rive Waikhyrwi ( in Jaintia Hills) for the purpose of supplying water to Sutnga village has been done in a haphazard manner ?

(b)

Whether the governments aware of the fact that the standard of work in the construction of the said dam is very low.

Shri Sandford K. Marak Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering replied :- 

80(a)

No

(b)

No.

Shri H. Hadem :-  80(a) Mr. Speaker Sir, whether the construction of the dam has been completed ?

Shri Sandford K. Marak Minister of Public Health Engineering  :- The construction work is in progress.

New Water Supply Schemes for Jaintia Hills

Shri Onward Leyswell Nongtdu asked :- 

81.

Will the Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering  be pleased to state the new Water supply Schemes the Government proposes to take up in Jaintia Hills during 1975-76 ?

Shri Sandford K. Marak Minister in charge of Public Health Engineering replied :-

81.

The schemes proposed to be taken up during 1975-76 have not been finalised ; there are under survey and investigation.

Agricultural Loans sanctioned for each District.

Shri G. Mylliemngap asked :-

82.

Will the Minister in charge of Agriculture be please to state ;-

(a)

The amount sanctioned for Agricultural Loans to each District during 1973-74 and 1974-75 ?

(b)

The total amount drawn by each District Authorities During 1973-74 and 1974-75 ?

(c)

Whether the sanctioned amounts have been fully drawn during 1973-74 and 1974-75 ?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh Minister in charge of Revenue replied :-

82(a) 

The following amounts are sanctioned a Agriculture loans to each District :-

1973-74

Garo Hills District

Rs. 25,100.00

Khasi Hills District

Rs.52,662.00

Jaintia Hills

Nil

1974-75:-

Garo Hills District

Rs. 2,34,725.00

Khasi Hill District 

Rs.22,500.00

Jaintia Hills District

Rs. 10,000.000

(b) & (c) - 

The total amount drawn by each District Authority is a follow :-

1973-74-

Garo Hills District

Rs. 22,338.00

Khasi Hills District 

Rs. 52,662.00

1974-75

        The amounts for 1974-75 were sanctioned on 15th February 1975..These amounts have not be a drawn upto 10th March 1975.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  82(a) may we know the reason why the amount sanctioned for Khasi Hills for 1974-75 has slammed down to Rs. 22,500. vis a vis Rs. 2,34,725. for Garo Hills.?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :- The nature of the calamity in the Garo Hills is well known to the hon. Member of the House because of the flood. So the amount for Khasi Hills is comparatively smaller compared to Garo Hills ?

Shri S. D. Khongwir :- May we know whether these agricultural loans are being given to flood affected persons. ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :-  Mainly Sir.,

Shri S. P. Swer :- May we know the rate of interest fixed for these loans.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :-  I want notice for that question

Promotion of Senior Gram Sevaks to the post of Agriculture Inspector.

Shri Samarendra Sangma  asked :-

83.

Will the Minister in charge of Community Development be pleases to state :-

(a)

Whether there is any bar for promoting senior Gram Sevaks with  long service and with extensive and varied Agricultural Training of their Credit to the post of Assistant Agricultural Inspector or Agricultural Inspector ?

(b)

The basis of the determining the Seniority between Senior Gram Sevaks from Agricultural Demonstrators with equal length of service and training ?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh Minister in charge of Community Development replied :- 

83(a)

Yes Because the Senior Gram  Sevak Gram Sevaks and the Assistant Agricultural  Inspectors or Agricultural Inspectors do not belong to the same service.

(b)

Does not arise.

License for opening Liquor Bars in Shillong .

Shri Dolsing Lyngdoh asked :- 

84. 

Will the Minister-incharge of Excise be pleased be state :-

(a)

Whether Government propose to issue more licenses to to open liquor bars in Shillong?

(b)

Whether it is a fact that the increase in the number of liquor  bar has bad moral effect on the youth in Meghalaya

(c)

The benefit derived by the Government by giving license for opening Bar ?

Shri Edwingson Bareh Minister of Excise :-  replied .

84(a)

There is no proposal  at present to increase the number of foreign liquor Bars in Shillong.

(b)

Not to our knowledge.

(c)

Revenue in the shape of surcharge and license fee.

Development of Fishery in the State.

Shri Samarendra Sangma asked :- 

85.

Will the Minister in charge of fishery be pleased to state :-

(a)

The total expenditure during the year 1973-74 and 1974-75 for the development of Fishery in the State (District wise ) with particulars may kindly be furnished ?

(b)

The approximate expenditure for the excavation of a fishery tank of an area covered by one Bighas with the depth of six feet at the minimum prevailing rate in the State ?

(c)

Whether Government is granting any financial assistance to the District Councils for fishery development ?

(d)

If so the amount of money being utilised ?

Shri Grohonsing A Sangma Minister of Fishery  replied :-

85(a)

 The statement of expenditure in the State District wise 1973-74 and 1974-75 Upto 31st January 1975 is placed on the Table of the House.

(b)

Rupees 1,000 (One thousand) approximately.

(c) 

- No

(d)

Does not arise in view of (c) above.

Implementation of rural Employment Schemes in Jaintia Hills

Shri Lewis Bareh asked :- 

86.

Will the Minister in charge of Community Development be pleased to state :-

(a)

The names of schemes implemented for removal of rural un employment during the year 1974-75 in Jaintia Hills with the  amount sanctioned for each scheme ?

(b)

The agency through which the said schemes have been implemented ?

(c)

The persons or agency who draw the sanctioned amount under each scheme ?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh Minister in charge of Community Development replied :-

86(a)- 

The schemes implementation under the Crash  Schemes for rural employment in Jaintia Hills during 2974-75 are ?

Scheme

Amount Sanctioned.

1.Construction of Thangbuli Amchong Road

47.000.00

2.Construction of Mynso Umaladang Road

40.000.00

3..Construction of Kyndongtuber Madan Pamsna

84.000.00

4.Construction of Tarangblang Borghat Road

30.000.00

5.Constructionof Umlangshu Ummat Road

56.000.00

The schemes were sanctioned during 1973-74 and none has been sanctioned during 1974-75.

(b)

The schemes are implemented through the Block agency.

(c)

The amount was drawn by the  Block Development Officer.

Shri H. Hadem :-  86(a), 3- May we know the whether any provision for maintenance of the road is being made ?    

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Community Development :- No, Sir.

Shri H. Hadem :- Then may we know how the road will be maintained in the future ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Community Development :- We expect that the community and other agencies like the Block and the District Council wherever there is a deserving case will take up.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :- How many of these roads have been taken up and completed ?    

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :- Schemes had been implemented.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  That means they are completed.    

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :- Schemes have been implemented with what ever amount allotted.

Shri H. Hadem :- 86(a), 2- May we know in which part of the Mynso this road runs whether Mynso of this side or Mynso of that side (laughter) because there are two Mynsos.

Shri B. B., Lyngdoh Minister of Revenue :- I want notice for that.

Shri H. Hadem :- Sir why I am asking the question is because there are two Mynsos.

Mr. Speaker :-  Let us pass on to item No.2 Minister incharge of Parliamentary Affairs to move grant No.1.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Parliamentary Affairs :- Mr. Speaker Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor, I beg to move that an amount of  Rs. 19,19,500 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray certain charges which will come in the course of the payment during the year ending the 31st March, 1976 for the administration of the head "211- Parliament/State/Union Territory Legislature -B- State Legislatures.

Mr. Speaker :-  Motion moved since I have received no cut motion let me put the question before the House. The question is that an amount of Rs. 19,19,500 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray certain charge which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "211-Parliament /State/Union Territory-B- State Legislature.

The motion was carried and the demand was passed.)

        Now the Chief Minister to move Grant No.2.

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister :- Mr. Speaker Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor, I beg to  move that an amount of Rs. 10.000 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray the certain charges which will come in the course of the payment during the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the Administrative of the head " 212 Governor".

Mr. Speaker :-  Motion Moved since I have received no Cut motion let me put the question  before the House. The question is that an amount of Rs.10.000 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray the certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "218-Governor".

(The motion was carried and the demand was passed .)

        Now the Chief Minister to move Grant No.3.

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister :- Mr. Speaker Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor I beg to move that an amount of Rs. 7,89,000 be granted to the Minster in charge to defray certain charges which will come in the course of payment during  the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "213 Council of Ministers".

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved But I have received one cut motion which stands in the name of the Shri H. Enowell Pohshna Shri Pohshna to move.

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna :- Mr. Speaker Sir, I beg to move that the total provision of Rs. 7,89,000 under Grant No.3 Major head "213 Council of Minister" at page 13 of the Budget be reduced by Rs. 100.00 i.e. amount of the whole grant Rs. 7,89,000 do stand reduced by Rs. 100.00.

Mr. Speaker:- The motion moved. Now you can initiate a discussion .This is token cut and you can discuss only the necessity, utility or or otherwise of the extensive tours which were performed by the Ministers.

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, In moving this motion. I may touch only point which is very very important and that is that in my District of Jaintia Hills we find that only one Minister is making an extensive tour throughout the District and we are very grateful to him for that. But ever since the inception of our own State, we have not found except on two occasions that our Chief Minister is  touring in the interior areas of Jaintia Hills District.'

Mr. Speaker :-  You should have extended an invitation to him.

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna :-  I have met many of the people in the border areas and in the interior areas of Jaintia Hills and they would be very glad if the Chief Minister at least, would visit their areas once in the years. However we are very glad that the Chief Minister had visited the District Council during the opening ceremony of the Jaintia Hills District. It is in the fitness of things that the Chief Minister had visit the interior areas of the State. Therefore, Sir, I want a few clarifications rather I would like to request the Chief Minister to tell us why he does not pay any attention to the people of Jaintia Hills. We are very glad to receive him especially now when the time of election is drawing near. With these few words, I  move my cut motion

]Mr. Speaker :-  Your only point is to see that the Chief Minister visit Jaintia Hills. You should not have moved this cut motion rather you should have requested the Chief Minister in his Chamber.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :-  I support the cut motion laughter.

Shri H. Hadem :-  If the Chief Minister would reply, then there will be no chance for us to say something. This is the only point that the hon. Mover Shri Pohshna want the chief Minister to visit Jaintia Hills. In that case Sir, I would like to oppose the cut motion (laud laughter). 

        Well Sir examining the cut motion tabled by the hon. Member it appears that he is against the extensive tours performed by the Ministers.

Mr. Speaker :- The cut motion is on the utility or otherwise... 

Shri H. Hadem :- Actually, Sir, in token cut the hon. Member is to express his grievances. But there are no grievances at all. He rather invited more extensive tour besides the fact that Minister have already undertaken extensive tours. He wants also the chief Minister to make an extensive tour in the the Jaintia Hills.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :- He insists on the utility of extensive tours by the Chief Minister.

Mr. Speaker :- No, he wants to bring to the notice of the House that only one Minister has been doing extensive tours and be wants that the Chief Minister also would take up extensive tour of Jaintia Hills.

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna :- My point is that the Chief Minister should make extensive tour and there should not be any tour from other Ministers.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Speaker Sir, in view of what the hon. Mover has stated in his Cut motion I oppose the cut motion.

Mr. Speaker :-  Will the chief Minister reply now ?

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, as well as the hon. Member of this august House, I think I do not have much to reply on this. But it will be best on my part to promise the hon. Mover of the cut Motion that in future, I will try to comply with his request. I will try to visit some areas in Jaintia Hills as well. However it would not be possible for me to have extensive tours in all areas. But as the hon. Members should know that even if the Chief Minister could not visit all the areas his colleagues any visit deferent areas as they represent him. We have a joint responsibility. The problems which have been reported to my colleagues during their tours to those areas will be looked into the taken note of. I feel sorry Sir, that in the past I could not make repeated visits to the Jaintia Hills. However it is not a fact that I have visited only twice. I have visited four or five times. I am prepared to accept the invitations to visit Jaintia Hill in future. In view of the clarifications and promise. I think there would not be any reason for the hon. Mover to insist on this cut motion.

Shri H. Enowell Pohshna :-  Since the chief Minister has made an assurance to visit Jaintia Hills I withdraw my cut motion.

Mr. Speaker :-  Has the hon. Member leave of the House to withdraw his motion. 

(Voices Yes Yes)

        The Cut motion on is with leave of the House withdrawn.

        I put the question before the House. The question is that an amount of Rs.. 7,89,000 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray the certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "213-Council of Minister ".

The motion was carried and the demand was passed.

        Now the Minister incharge of  Law to move Grant No.4.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh Minister of Law :- Mr. Speaker Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor, I beg to move that an amount of Rs. 6,90,900 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray the certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the  year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "213 Administration of Justice ".

Mr. Speaker :-  Motion moved I have received the Cut Motion one in the name of Shri S. N. Koch and another in the name of Shri Francis K. Mawlot. The hon. Member are absent. The cut motions stand automatically withdrawn. Now I put the question before the House. The question is that an amount of Rs. 6,90,900 be granted to the Minister incharge to defray the certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "214-Administration of Justice ".

The motion was carried and the demand was passed .

        Now the Chief Minister  to move the No.5.

Shri W. A. Sangma Chief Minister :- Mr. Speaker Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor. I beg to move that an amount of Rs. 7,19,600 be granted to the Minister in charge to defray certain charges which will come in the course of payment during  the year ending the 31st March 1976 for the administration of the head "215-Election".

Mr. Speaker :-  Motion moved I have received one Cut Motion which stand in the name of Shri D. N.  Joshi. Will Mr. D.N. Joshi move ?

Shri D. N. Joshi :-  Mr. Speaker Sir, I beg to move that that total provision of Rs. 7,19,600 under grant No.5 Major head " 215-Election" at page 25 of the budget be reduced by Rs. 100. i.e. the amount of the whole grant of Rs. 7,19,600 fo stand reduced by  Rs. 100.

Mr. Speaker :-  Motion moved. Now you can raise a discussion of the revision of the voters list.

Shri D. N. Joshi :- Mr. Speaker,  Sir, I am very sorry that I have to move this Cut motion on a very important point which affects the very fundamental rights of citizen of our State. Sir on 31st December 1974 I gathered that the Government of India's Election. Commission instructed our State Government to take up revision of the electoral rolls in our school. The first instruction was fore calling for objections and inclusion and the date given for different areas is from the 31st December 1974 to 16th January this year. Sir, the publication of the draft electoral rolls done on the strength of enumeration that had been done earlier is not proper and methodical. However the Government came out on my enquiry with  a reply that the draft electoral roll was based on the electoral roll published in 1970. So some objections and inclusion were made on the strength of that electoral roll made in 1970.

Mr. Speaker :-  And there  was no exclusion.

Shri D. N. Joshi :- No, Sir, that was not my point. I want only inclusion though exclusion also might be there and perhaps persons might die in  the1974 and might be that some of them have been deleted. But I am not very sure of it. Anyway, Sir after the 16th January this year there was fresh revision of electoral roll and a door to door enumeration was started by the Department concerned and enumerators went round some localities to have fresh enumeration. Some of them went to the rural areas and some to the urban areas. But to my dismay I found that the enumerators who went to my locality touched one house left another house and then went to the third house and left another those and so on and forth. When I came to learn about the matter I brought it to the notice of the District Returning Officer who was kind enough to instruct the local Election Officer to look into it and he very promptly conceded to the demands of mine to recheck the revision of the electoral rolls and also the enumeration side of the electoral rolls and then enumerators visited the same locality again. But Sir I am very much constrained to let the House know that during the enumeration that was done in the rural areas and even in Shillong town itself the enumerators failed to visit some localities. That may be deliberately or inadvertently done by the enumerators. Even in Mawprem itself in a patch between Lama Villa Nulla and the Road leading to Bishop Falls there is an big pitch where  dozen of houses are situated and that locality was left out. And here in the  Cantonment area where the Transport  Office is located, I remember that area was entirely left out and I brought the matter again to the notice of the Election Officer, but he said that there was a case in Shillong town itself being left out and in  spite of his repeated requests the enumerators had not gone there because they had already visited the area. So not  he would take up the matter with the Ward Commission of that area. And I do not know whether he has taken up the matter or not as he said. But Sir there was no time left according to the time schedule. Then again Sir, here is Khasi Hills in the western upland area I have seen that not a single Nepalese was enumerated in the list. There wee many Nepalese whose names have been enrolled in election roll of the previous elections, and they have been staying here even since before the inception of this Constitution itself, but  their names have been dropped from the list of voters this time and the reasons as told are that they require to produce citizenship certificate. And the enumerators it is reported have got instructions from the authority concerned not to include their names in the electoral rolls unless they can produce the citizenship certificate. Sir In Sonapahar also some Nepalese labourers who were enumerated for the last 10 or 20 years were later on left out. The Election Officers went there and demanded back the duplicate slips which wee issued to them earlier and the enumerators have withdrawn al the slips from them that is the duplicate of the enumeration list already issued to them were withdrawn by the enumerators. Why these Nepalese who  have been residing here in this land for many year and who have adopted this land as their own land, contributing their mite for the development of the State and are living in these Hills for years together and are also responsible in the army for the defence development of the Country and who again are doing their best to beautify our State and are raising the agriculture in so far as grazing is concerned, are not given their right to exercise their franchise? Why should they be deprived  their rights be they from the A.P.H.L.C. or the Congress or any party when they have all got the same rights like others to exercise their franchise. Therefore, I demand that this Government should take up with the Election Commission that time be extended and extensive enumeration of the electoral rolls be done so as to see that not a single person is left out when he is eligible whether he be a tribal or non-tribal, he must be included in the enumeration list. With these few words I resume my seat. 

Mr. Speaker:-Your point No.1 was that the enumerators worked haphazardly; (2) that in some areas none of the Nepalese were registered and (3) that the Government take up the matter with the Election Commission to extend the time limit. 

Shri D.N. Joshi :- Yes Sir, the limit if the electoral roll is not prepared. 

Mr. Speaker :- Now, it is open for discussion. Any one to support?

Shri H. E. Pohshna:- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I support the cut motion. It is the right of every citizen who is a Meghalayan to have a vote.....

Mr. Speaker:-I think any Indian is equal in this matter; not only Meghalayans. 

Shri H. E. Pohshna:-As far as the Nepalese who have been here in this State are concerned it is painful that they have been rejected or not included in the electoral rolls. On the other hand , if it is the case of pother people in the State, enrolment has been done but while for Nepalese a certificate is necessary. I do not see the reason why. Moreover, if any inclusion of a wrong person is made in the electoral roll, everybody has a right to object because the Government used to invite objection for any person included in the electoral roll. Therefore, Sir, with these few words, I support the cut motion. 

Mr. Speaker :- Since nobody would like to participate, may I ask the Chief Minister to reply.

Shri W. A. Sangma (Chief Minister):-Mr. Speaker, Sir, earlier we had occasion to discuss this particular matter in the House. At that time, it was pointed out to the Government, through you, Sir, that enumeration has not been done properly. I have had occasion to reply to that. It may be that there have been acts of omissions or commission, but in this particular matter, the active cooperation of the leaders belonging to different political parties is very essential. I am glad that the mover of the cut motion had the occasion to report this matter to the concerned authority. Such cooperation is very helpful. I wish that the leaders belonging to different political parties take such interest to see that enumeration is done properly. This is the usual complaint in the past also that the enumerators did not visit house to house. It has also been brought to the notice of the Government that sometimes, specially in the rural areas, these enumerators simply go to the bazars and consult it the chiefs on the electoral roll of the previous elections and try to correct them. Knowing all these factors, it is the duty of the political leaders of different political parties to take action on these activities. Sir, I know that the hon. member was very unhappy, because according to him, a large number of Nepalese who are eligible voters have not been enumerated. It is a fact that the Nepalese who are born and brought up in India have acquired citizenship by virtue of Article 5 of the Constitution of under Section 3 or 4 of the Citizenship Act, 1955. If, however, they voluntarily acquire the citizenship of a foreign State subsequently, the case to be the citizens of India under Article 9 of the Constitution. There is also the possibility that a large number of the Nepalese might have migrated to India only recently. In this connection, I would like to give the hon. Members a specific information as to what is happening in my District, Garo Hills. In that District, we have about 300 t o400 graziers (Khuti wallas). These graziers used to bring large number of Nepalese from Nepal to look after their cattle in the farm. I am doubtful if they have been registered under the relevant Act as citizens of India. 

        In their case, therefore, the question of citizenship crops up at the time of enrolment of names  in Electoral Rolls. Naturally, there is, therefore, need for caution in enrolment of Nepalese's as voters. It is not correct to state that getting oneself enrolled as a voter is his fundamental right, because unless he is an Indian citizen he cannot register as a voter. However, I am not going to say that those who are citizen of India under the provision of the Constitution and under the relevant Act should be denied their right enrolled as voters. But I would emphasise that we have to see that the non-citizens are not enrolled as voters. In this task, it will be only with the help and co-operation of the leaders that we shall be able to find out as to whether the persons are eligible or not to be enrolled as voters. This is particularly so in respect of Bhoi Areas of Khasi Hills and certain areas in Jaintia Hills and Garo Hills as well. We cannot take it for granted that because of the Nepalee families have acquired land for dwelling houses that they are Indian citizens. However, I can assure the hon. member that with his co-operation and with the cooperation of all the hon. Member even now. It is best to get the eligible ones enumerated as stated earlier; of course they will have to pay the late fee. But it is necessary on the part of the Department concerned to exercise careful scrutiny as far as this particular community is concerned because it is known to the Government that there has been a migration from Nepal to the State recently. I know about it in Garo Hills and that it takes place in Bhoi Area of Khasi hills. In view of this, it will be very difficult for the Department concerned to take for granted that every Nepalee found in the State is an Indian. I would therefore make an appeal to the hon. Mover to take proper interest on this and to help the Department concerned to see that those who are Indian citizens among the Nepalee community are enrolled as voters, and he would also equally help in identifying the new comers who have not acquired citizenship and as such are not eligible to be enrolled as voters. 

Shri D. N. Joshi :- Mr. Speaker, Sir as a responsible citizens of  Meghalaya and as a public leaders as an MLA., I had occasion to speak on the floor of this House on this right in 1972 and I had suggested to the Government to come out with a plan to find out a proper survey of the people of our State. There were apprehensions in the minds of the local leaders and in the minds of the local people whether they are tribals or non tribals that due to the inflow of certain non tribals, a lot of the non-tribals who had already adopted this land as their home State will be affected. There  were apprehensions, Sir. 

Mr. Speaker: - This is not relevant to the Cut Motion. 

Shri D. N. Joshi :- Because the Chief Minister wanted co-operation, Sir, that is what I am trying to give my co-operation. 

Mr. Speaker:-Mr. Joshi, the eligible persons should be listed as terse, that is the co-operation that the Chief minister has sought. 

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Well Sir, it is not only in respect of the persons belonging to the Nepalee origin but in the past, we have had migration from East Pakistan also. They have migrated to India but they cannot be registered as voters. I know in Garo Hills in 1964 a large number of Garo families from erstwhile East Pakistan had come over and the Government of India had given them rehabilitation in consultation with the District Council. But they had to get the registration first as Indian citizen for enrolment as voters. In a similar way, we cannot take it for granted that all Nepalese are eligible to be voters. I am sure the local leaders will know who are born and brought up here, and are therefore, citizens of India. But at the same time, I may, through you, Sir, inform the hon. Member that, as far as Nepalese coming to India are concerned, unlike people coming from other foreign countries, it is very easy for them to come and to go back. Therefore, it is all the more essential to be sure that they have acquired Indian citizenship. In fact we are very much concerned about it, and w have taken it up with the Government of India. We find new faces coming every day. There should be restriction against this continual influx. Therefore, I am sure the House will appreciate that this is a peculiar and difficult problem and we have to take necessary steps against it and see that only Indian citizens are controlled as voters. This question as I have said has been taken up with the Government  of India. The revision of the electoral rolls has been taken up on the basis of a crash programme limiting the period from 6th months to 2 months only as per direction by the Election Commission. I do not know what were the reasons for taking up this particular work in a crash programme. Whatever may be the reason or reasons we have to complete the work within the time schedule as fixed by the election Commission. So I do not see any need for the Government to take up this matter with the Election Commission. So, I do not see any need for the Government to take up this matter with the Election Commission. I would, therefore, request  the hon. Members belonging to different political parties to see that all eligible people are enrolled as voter, irrespective of the fact as to whether they are Nepalees, or tribals or non-tribals. But there is a need for taking precaution to see that only those who are eligible, being Indian citizens, are enrolled as voters. Therefore, Sir, now if the hon. member feels that he wants to enroll certain people as voters, well he can take up the matter with the concerned Department by applying and paying the prescribed fee for this. So, with these few words, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I request the hon. member to withdraw his Cut Motion.

Shri D.N. Joshi :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, in view of the assurances given by the Chief Minister, that in the extensive enumeration work for the electoral roll in future for the general election, particular care be taken for enrolment of the eligible voters whether they are Nepalees or Bengalees or anybody, I withdraw my Cut Motion.

Mr. Speaker :- Has the hon. Member leave of the House to withdraw his cut Motion ?

(Voices-Yes, yes)

        The cut motion is with leave of the House withdrawn.

        Now, I put the question before the House. The question is that an amount of Rs. 7,19,600 be granted to the Minister-in-charge to defray certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March, 1976 for the administration of the head "15-Election".

(The motion was carried and the demand was passed).

        Now, I call upon the Minister-in-charge of Revenue to move Grant No. 6.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue etc) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, on the recommendation of the Governor, I beg to move that an amount of Rs. 11,31,000 be granted to the Minister-in-charge to defray certain charges which will come in the course of payment during the year ending the 31st March, 1976 for the administration of the head "229-Land Revenue."

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. I have seen that there are 3 Cut Motions standing in the names of Shri Rowell Lyngdoh, Shri Stanlington David Khongwir and Shri Francis K. Mawlot. Now, Mr. Rower Lyngdoh?

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the total provision of Rs. 11,31,000 under Grant No. 6, Major Head "299-Land Revenue" at page 31 of the budget be reduced to Re. 1.00 i.e., the amount of the whole grant of Rs. 11,31,000, do stand reduced to Re. 1.00.

Mr. Speaker : Motion moved. Now, you can initiate the discussion about the policy followed by the Government on land revenue and land records.

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have a few points to offer in regard to this Land Revenue. Sir, first of all on the subject, we have seen the estimates of receipts for the current year, i.e., for the coming year. It shows that it is expected to derive only an amount of Rs. 1,42,500 whereas this is a land revenue Department through which we expected to derive more revenue. But then, on the receipt side the estimated amount of receipts is only that much whereas the estimate for expenditure is about Rs. 1,31,300. So, being a Revenue Department but then only 1/11th we are estimating to get receipts from that Department, whereas, we are to spend 11 times that amount. But what I want to point out  here is that under land revenue and land acquisition Sir, for the last few years, we have been discussing about the inefficiency, about the slow progress on the performance of that department. The S.D.Cs. are generally complaining that we are short of staff and the Government itself is also complaining that they are short of S.D.Cs. This fact was many times discussed in this House and it might have improved I think but even then the settlement of land compensation and other works which are connected with this subject is still on the some condition as it was before. Now where the P.W.D. wants to take up certain, roads people have lost confidence and they have started obstructing the construction of roads because they are not sure whether they are going to get the land compensation or not. Therefore, generally the people are starting demanding to pay first before the land is taken. So this is the sort of thing that is going to happen now-a-days. The people have lost their faith because of the slow action on the part of that department. Sir earlier we have suggested that one S.D.C. should be attached to each P.W.D. Division or atleast to P.W.D. Division or atleast or to P.W.D. Department for expeditious disposal of this land compensation work. But then till now, nothing has been done. So we want again to suggest that the Government should attach one S.D.C. of that department. If possible to each Division of P.W.D. so that speedy disposal of land compensation could be ensured. And on the land record, Sir, we do not know what record is there when we have got the Directorate of land Records, the revenue derived is very small. So I do not know why the Government is spending so much money for the staff and officers of the Directorate of Land Record. Sir so long, during the previous regime of Assam Government as well as now the Government are insisting on the patta system and specially in the hill areas. When housing loan is applied by the Government servants, the Government is always asking for patta to be mortgaged for the same purpose. Here in the Khasi Hills District since a very long time we did not know about that patta system but during the Government of Assam  they started introducing this patta system. Now this Government, even though it is our own Government and though they know about the land tenure, land system here in the District and as well as in other District of the State, they are encouraging the people to seek for patta. This system gives more power and encourages the land owners and Zamindars to insist on patta to demand also taxes from the people who have got patta of the land, Sir, in this respect I think in olden  days, the people used to believe only on sale deeds but now the Government itself is encouraging the land owners to give or issue patta.

Mr. Speaker :- But then what happens if land owner applies for a loan.

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh : Yes, Sir, we do not know whether the land-owners apply for the loan , because they are very rich people, I think they need not apply for any loan. Therefore, I request the Government that this practice should be discontinued. The Government should not insist only on patta but should insist only on sale deed otherwise it  will deprive our people in the village of acquiring any land and housing loans Last year we requested the Government to extend housing loan facilities to the rural areas but then if the Government is still  insisting on this patta system the villagers may not be able to get such benefit. Therefore for this the Land Record or Land Revenue should recognise the sale deeds only and not the patta system, Sir.  Sir, the functions of this department specially in the District level and also in the offices of the District Collector or Sub-divisional Collector are very poor. The officers and staff either used to go on tour always and because of this the progress of the work is slow. But whenever the public or representatives go to the office to find out certain information about land compensation and about other things Sir, there is not much response from  them and the work is not progressing. So what I want to suggest is that the Government should be little more strict on this and issue instructions to all officers. The Government should pay more attention to this so that the performance is better than it was earlier during the Government of Assam. Sir, I do not have more points before this House as other members who will move the cut motion will come forward with more and similar points. So with these few words I resume my seat.

Mr. Speaker : Before I ask the hon. Members to move the other cut motions, do I have the leave of the House to bracket the cut motions one standing in the name of Shri Rowell Lyngdoh and the other in the name of Shri S.D. Khongwir.

(Voices-Yes, yes)

*Shri S.D. Khongwir : Mr. Speaker, Sir I would also like to say a few words in connection with this particular grant-Grant No. 6 on land revenue. I have actually moved a separate cut motion, but since the hon.  member the mover of the first cut motion has already touched on certain point which I had in mind to speak in connection with my cut motion with your leave, I will now participate by way of supporting the first cut motion already moved.

Mr. Speaker : In that case, you may withdraw your own cut motion.

Shri S.D. Khongwir : I have bracketed them. Mr. Speaker Sir, we have had the occasion earlier to discuss about this question of payment of compensation and every time we brought this matter before the House, we used to get the same reply from the Government that the Government will see to it and try to help the people to facilitate payment of compensation  to them. But Mr. Speaker, Sir, upto this day, we have not been able to see any improvement with regard to the assurances and promises given by the Government on the floor of the House. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as public representatives, we are somehow or other involved in the question of payment of compensation especially to the poor people who have given their lands, say about 500 to 1000sq. ft but could not afford to go directly to the Chief Minister or the Minister-in-charge of Revenue or the Deputy Commissioner for that matter to present their case before them. These poor people used to come to us and we, as public representative, are involved in this question of payment of compensation. Mr. Speaker, Sir, in so far as this particular matter is concerned, I beg to State that it is a policy of delay and discrimination. It is a policy of delay because it takes such a long time for the Collector or the Government to finalise the amount of compensation that is to be paid to the people. Why I say discrimination because in certain cases involving rich people who have got huge land, within no time, compensation amounting to lakhs and lakhs of rupees was paid to them. But in the case of the poor people, it will take not less then 3 to 6 years. So, Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Government is following the policy of discrimination. From our side, we expect that the Government should lend their supporting hands especially to the poor section of the people, but instead Government are only helping the rich. So Mr. Speaker, Sir, let this be the last time that we will, bring any cut motion on this particular subject and I hope the Hon'ble Minister who will see shortly reply to our cut motions will once again say that Government will see to these matters and that these matters are receiving the active, if not very active, consideration of the Government. From our side we will make a solemn promise before this House that in the next Budget Session we will not bring any cut motion on this particular grand provided that the Government fulfill their promises.

Mr. Speaker :-  Sir, another very important, I should say charming point at least to me that has been raised by the hon mover, is on the question of patta system. I do not know whether you will allow me to say a few words on this question because the matter is at present subjudice.

Mr. Speaker :- Is it pending in the Court?

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- Yes it is in the court on a particular issue of patta system that the people of Mawlai brought this mater before the court about the legality of the patta system.

Mr. Speaker : Do not refer to that particular case. Are you yourself involved in that matter?

Shri S.D. Khongwir : I am a party.

Mr. Speaker : I think I will not allow you to speak on it.

Shri S.D. Khongwir : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I have a personal knowledge of the case and that is why I have informed you and sought your guidance whether I can discuss this matter as I also happen to be a party in the case.

Mr. Speaker : Since you are a party in that particular case, I would rather advice you to avoid  any reference  to that particular  case. But since  the issue involves the whole principle of patta system, you may discuss on that. Other members will discuss  the patta system,  in general avoiding that particular  case which  is pending before the court of law.

Shri S. D. Khongwir : With these words, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I hope the Government will really look into these problems and I can  cite several examples, but this is not the proper time to do. I would rather like to get  the assurance of the Minister once more that his  department would look into all the cases irrespective  of the fact that it involves rich people or poor people. With these few words, I resume my seat. 

Start Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to say just a few words on the question of land compensation and I support the cut motion. The Government, in the last two or three Sessions of the Assembly had promised to look into  the matter and during  the last Budget Session also the Government had promised that they would look into the question with special reference to the shortage of staff in the office of the Collector. But till now, with the special reference to the Khasi Hills District, there are land compensation cases which are being kept pending now for the last 15 years. We may mention here, specially in the P. W. D. 

Mr. Speaker : The P. W. D.?

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Yes, while constructing a road from Mawsynram to Balat land compensation had to be paid to the  people. Then also land compensation was involved in road construction from Sohiong to Pariong, from Mawshynrud to Nonshram  on which the Minister had promised that within one year he would do it. That was promised in 1972. Sir, the road from Mawmaram to Nongthliew, then the road from Pengtung  to Lyngkhat and Wahlong to Nongspung  and then the road from Mawthawpdah to Phlangdiloin and then the road from Pynursla to Lyngkhat Tmar on which the compensation cases are still pending. Sir, if I name all the roads, it will take half an hour. Then there is another compensation case for construction of a road from Nongkhlaw to Ranigodam at Nongkhlaw. It is lying pending for 15 years. It was a road since the Second Five Year Plan period. Sir, the Government had promised last time to speed up payment of compensation but the fact remains that there is no S. D. C. entrusted  with the work of taking measurement or for calculating the rate at which such compensation is to the paid to the land owners, During the last two or three years, there were two S. D. Cs at Shillong whose work was to look into the matter, but one was involved with military work and the other with public works. But, so far as I know, during the last year there was only one S. D. C. and this year I think  there was only one S. D. C and this year I think  there are 2 in the Khasi Hills District. As their services are very  necessary, two more  can be appointed. Examples, can be cited here of one officer who thinks that he is monarch of all he surveys, and sometimes he forgets even his duty of speeding up the work of payment of compensation and particularly he delays matters. There is another instance and I have got a report that the S. D. C. has been asked to go to Nongkroh last month on the Mawshamok-Laitkynsew Road for land compensation to be paid to the local people. But this officer is always  dragged away by the people this way and that way and so he never reached Nongkroh. It shows that one S. D. C. in the Khasi Hills District cannot perform his duty. So I want to remind the House the assurance given by the Government, during the last two or three sessions and that assurance must be fulfilled. If at all the Government appoints more S. D. C.s. or more Collectors in the District, I think all these arrears payments of compensation will be cleared up. So, with these few words, I support the cut motion.

Shri W. Syiemiong :Mr. Speaker, Sir, I wonder if I can  add anything more to what my hon. friend has already stated. But one thing that strikes me most as a layman and I look from a lay man's point of view - is that this head falls under the Land Revenue and we all understand that land revenue means that there must be some revenue, as the hon. members has just stated. But it seems we are rearing a white elephant ; we are getting only Rs.1 lakh and paying Rs. 11 lakhs. I am quite sure that the Government will not agree with me but I feel that, in my opinion, it is better to do away with this Department or rather do away with revenue. Of what use is revenue when we got only Rs.1 lakhs, and have to pay Rs. 11 lakhs. That one point which I find I cannot agree.

    Another point is on land compensation cases on which my hon. friend has touched and, so, I will not burden this House by citing other cases. So, I would say only a few on the patta system on which.........

Mr. Speaker : Ordinarily, the hon. member shall refrain from raising any matter which is pending before a court of law but if that particular issue, which you want to raise, has any relevancy with any other point then of course I can allow.

Shri W. Syiemiong : The point which I want to raise has no relevance with the case in the court. I only want to go into the significance and meaning of the patta system because all along here in our Khasi Hills District..........

Mr. Speaker : That is the only issue pending before a court of law. The hon. mover has raised a pertinent question as to why the  Government should insist on the patta system when the person is in possession of the sale deed. That is the main contention of the mover. Of course, in that context there is no harm but if you are to discuss the utility or otherwise of that system, I am afraid, I can allow because it is pending in a court of law.

Shri W. Syiemiong : Just a way of speaking in a language; a person starts from the beginning and I may start from the end and I want to go exactly to that point as this system is prevalent here. Very recently this system has caused more problem to our people than it is expected to be beneficial to them. It is a system that we all along have not been used to. We do not know what is this patta system ;  it has only recently been introduced by, probably, some foreigners during the colonial days especially in Shillong. But inspite of the introduction made by these colonial lords, I think I can call them that, most of the people find it very difficult a practice because there is a differentiation between the land owners ; between the de-facto land owners and the de-jure land owners. The de-jure land owners do not require to have any patta but the de-facto land owners will have to pay some rent to the de-jure land owners. This is very system will only tell upon the small people who have to buy land from a big land lord. Sir, in issuing patta also several conditions are laid down by the land owners.

Mr. Speaker : That is exactly the point which I cannot allow you to discuss since the terms and conditions and their interpretation are pending before the court of law. You should better skip off that portion.

Shri W. Syiemiong : May I discuss something on Salami.

Mr. Speaker : I think  we are not very much concerned with the Salami in our land tenure system. Perhaps it is being practiced in some other parts of the country and I think all the hon. Members are aware of it. Better you skip off.

Shri H. Hadem : Mr. Speaker, Sir, is there any harm to discuss the merits and demerits of a case even it is pending before the court of law?

Mr. Speaker : No; the item itself is so difficult that it may not be possible for a particular hon. Member to differentiate as to which side of the case is being examined by the court of law and it is also wrong to discuss the merits and demerits of a particular portion of a case outside the jurisdiction of the court.

Shri W. Syiemiong : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would only like to say that the Government knowing all these problems of the people should decide whether they should recognize and honour the patta system. What I feel more fir and proper  is that the Government should do away  with the patta system otherwise in future  there will be more problems for the people out of this system.

Mr. Speaker : Will the Minister-in-charge of Revenue reply?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) :  Mr. Speaker, Sir, first of all I would like to discuss a small point raised in the beginning regarding the receipts and expenditure so far this is concerned. In fact it may be so, Sir, that the name of the Department itself was misleading taking it as a revenue earning Department. As a matter of fact it is not so much a Department for revenue earning rather this Department deals with land compensation, relief, etc. So  it is more a spending Department rather than earning Department. In other States, I may just explain,  it may be true when land revenue forms a major part of the income of the State. In fact,  in other States, this department is actually a collecting department ; an earning department. But so far our State is concerned, we get a small part of revenue from land  which falls in Shillong. But in Garo Hills and Jaintia Hills District the land revenue is being collected by the District Councils. But for administration of this Department our expenditure is quite big. This Department is concerned mainly with funds for relief, land records, land acquisition, etc. Let us not misunderstand about this.

    Then, Sir, the  main question raised by the hon. Members who have participated was regarding land compensation. But before that I would like to discuss the question of patta system. The question is that whether the Government should recognize  the pattas or sale deeds. That is the only question. Sir, this very thing has convinced this Government about the need very strongly  and urgently for the study of the land problems, the study  of the difficulties in land used the difficulties of land relationship especially in case of this District of Khasi Hills.

    It was being realised by all the leaders of all parties including the M. L. As, M. D. C.s in the meeting convened by the Chief Minister in September, 1972. It was unanimously felt that this problem that has been facing by the districts specially, this District in relationship to the difficulties that have arisen between the land owners and the Government, between the land owners and the money lenders. This problem has gathered momentum specially in view of the big change  that has been brought in since the  achievement of Independence. The administration is charged thoroughly from a Police State into a Welfare State and the Government is going to follow up strict records regarding utilisation of land in those areas required by the Government. Then people have come with an incentive of advancement for trade and commerce for loans from banks, from the money lenders and from the Government. Therefore, the question of records in land has become very very important. That is why we have come in a Commission to study all those problems and to make recommendations. We are very glad that within a very good time comparing to such works in the past, in other States, the Commission has been able to produce a very commendable report which I have tabled before the House. I have circulated to the hon. Members cyclostyled selected chapters to facilitate the study of this Report because I have not been able to get the  printed Report from the Press. As such, I would request the hon. Members to study the Report properly. If I am not mistaken, the said Commission has dealt very thoroughly with this question of patta system and therefore, the question of the Government insisting on patta or Sales Deed is that this Government simply would like to see that the person who comes to register that patta or sale deed within the Government or the Department of the Government, is correct especially with regard to the title of the person of that land. Then there was here one very  obvious and simple procedure and that is to produce  a document regarding the title, other-wise, the sale deeds question would be very difficult to decide. I do not know whether we have to consider it again in this House regarding the extent of registration which is in use within the Khasi Hills District. The Indian Registration Act, is applicable, only within five miles radius of Shillong. Therefore, people who have got lands outside, they have no registration. The sale deeds brought to the Courts or to the Department, they are not accepted unless they are registered first. This question has been very much in the concern of the people and the Government and this Government is considering seriously to make rules and laws to extend the benefits to the whole District in the State of Meghalaya.

Shri S. D. Khongwir :- Can we have one clarification? We have just heard a statement from the Revenue Minister regarding the applicability of the Registration Act to the areas within five miles radius from Shillong. May we know what is the attitude of the Government in so far as these areas are concerned whether the Registration Act has been already made applicable or whether the Government is still insisting on patta or sale deed?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : In this respect, I would like to say that a registered sale deed is enough for title anywhere either in Shillong or outside. However, this matter will be looked into thoroughly. I need not reiterate that the Commission has dealt with this matter that is the question of registration of title deeds, very carefully. I think this will also involve  that big question regarding cadastral survey of the whole District in the Cut Motion which we are yet to discuss. That is with regard to the record of rights. The question of registration of the document would not arise at all. But as security, the title of the person concerned is necessary to be verified because there are a lot of problems in this District in connection with the record of rights and ownership of land. Therefore, I say that we have to study very seriously and look into the matter a little deeply so that we can settle up the problem or at least, simplify it. It is a fact that we should have definite records of rights. These may be available with the Government, the District Councils and with those persons who  have got the document. Whether that document would be a patta or a sale deed, that is a different matter to be considered.

Shri Maham Singh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, but both form both of the title, anyone of them either patta or sale deed.

(At this stage the Hon'ble Speaker left the Chamber and the Deputy  Speaker occupied the Chair.)

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : Well, Sir, the question of patta as the hon. Member from Mawlai has stated, is a very important issue. Whether patta is necessary or legal, this is yet the question to be decided by the Government. However, the question is now under consideration by the Court. But the Government can make its own decision on this matter which is very desirable or beneficial in the interest of the State as a whole. But so far as this question of patta system is concerned, the hon. Members will be taken into confidence. Now, I would like to deal with compensation.

Shri S. D. Khongwir : On a point of clarification, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, may we have a categorical reply from the Minister regarding sale deed? He has stated that sale deed duly registered will be acceptable, that is a document to prove the title of a person because, several times, we went to the Government to file or register  sale dead, we find  that only patta is necessary, and they said they cannot accept the sale deed.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, so far as the question of sale deed is concerned, I would assure the House that it is legal and recognized. But why the patta is required, it may be that the officer of the Court would like to have complete document, as to the title of land owner so as to avoid unnecessary complications. Well, Sir, this is a different matter. I would say categorically that sale deed duly registered is being recognized as a legal basic document.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, may we have further clarification on this Sale deed registered within five miles radius from Shillong is acceptable by the Government. Then in that case may we know what about those sale deeds registered any where in the State like those in the interior areas of Khasi Hills? Those sale deeds registered  by the Syiems, Lyngdoh and somebody else outside the jurisdiction of the Act ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : Let me reply to that. Legal registration is only under the Indian Registration Act and  the document to be accepted by the Courts and the Government are only those documents registered under the Indian Registration Act. Therefore, registration that were done by the Syiems or from the  District Councils are perhaps matter of convention while circumstances in the Court and with the Government are different. I may cite an example. There is no use for a registration made by the then Raja Kine Singh in the Court since it is outside the preview of the Indian Registration Act....

Shri F. K. Mawlot : Only one clarification. Sir, what are the documents registered by the Government or by the Deputy Commissioner or by the Courts for those areas within  five miles radius. But I know Sir,  there are certain cases in which the Deputy  Commissioner registered those documents of lands in favor of a person even when they are no within five miles radius, i.e., they are more than five miles in radius?

Shri H. Hadem : May  I have one clarification, Sir, on this? Whether that registration will confer any title or right of ownership over any particular land. One more clarification, Sir, what about  the case of those Buniats in Jaintia Hills?

Shri H. S. Lyngdoh :Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Minister may kindly give a statement on each of the questions raised.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) :Now, on Mr. Hadem's question, I may say that it is simply  a notice that such a person has sold such lands and these notices are displayed in the D. C.'s office so that people  may come to the D.C. 's office and see if there is any objection to be filed as long as this Act is in force. Therefore, registration is a safe guard against multiple sale deeds on the same land and people may register their lands and notice of their registration may be made clear because the Court will not accept  any document unless it is registered under the Act. I have stated just now that it was the question of acceptability in the court. The registered documents relating to the particular lands should be acceptable to the court. The  court gave certain consideration, in evidence of unregistered  documents, but not very much legal and less value. Therefore, I hope that all hon. Members of this House should give their full support  and thoroughly study the Commission's Report.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, my question is : if they are outside this 5 miles' radius, whether their document if not registered will be accepted by the court?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) :They will be done according to the conviction and tradition. Now Mr.....

Shri Francis K. Mawlot : Why I say so is because registration is done by the Court. But if the areas fall beyond this 5 miles radius, say 30 miles away, can their registration be considered valid?

Shri H. S. Lyngdoh : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think the clarification sought by Shri F. K. Mawlot is not clear. The question is like this. There is the so-called Special Registration Branch in the D. C. 's office and not in the Court and the people from the interior places used to come and register their sale deeds and other documents there. But whether their documents which have been given notice of are recognized or not.

Shri Humphrey Hadem : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, on a point of order. May I ask whether this means interpretation of the law and whether this House is competent to interpret the law.

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the land belongs to the State and this is a State subject, but instead of confining to this  State subject, but instead of confining to this subject we are discussing about the Registration Act of the Central Government and whether Government in the Land Revenue Department can frame any rules for recognizing the holding of land owned not on the strength of the patta system but on sale deeds. Whether the sale deed is a registered one or not is a different thing. But what we want here is that Government should not recognize only this patta system but should also recognize sale deeds.

Shri H. S. Lyngdoh : There is nothing for which we have to divert from this question, we want only a clarification on the statement made by the Minister regarding sale deeds. It is only a matter of seeking clarification from the Minister.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : The question raised by the Mr. Mawlot is very simple. The Registration Act is applicable only to lands within a radius of 5 miles and their  documents have to be registered.

Shri Humphrey Hadem :Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, what about those Bunait lands in Jaintia Hills?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Agriculture) : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, may I have your permission to clarify on this? These are the Ri-kyntis of Jaintia Hills which were recognized from the time of the Jaintia Rajas up to the days of the British Government and the Government that came letter. They are not accessible and their records are being maintained in the office of the District Council.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : Sir, on the question of compensation, as most of the hon. Members had already mentioned, the question has come again and again and was being discussed in this House in various forms because this problem is a chronic problem for the last 20 years or so. Now this question of land compensation is being examined under the Land Acquisition Act and the procedure involved is really very complicated and time consuming. Why this is so? Because it is a compulsory acquisition which means depriving of fundamental right by force to take land for public interest and therefore, the law had provided quite elaborate provisions through  which we had to act in the process of acquisition. We will have to go through all formalities and a preliminary notification was to be issued under Section 4 calling for objections; we have to give every opportunity to the citizens whose land we are going to forcibly take. So it take some days and some weeks for this. Then again there is the question of disposal of these objections by the authorities concerned under Section 5 (a) ; then we have to follow another process of publication of declaration under Section 6 of the Land Acquisition Act and issue the annual notice to the claimant under Section 9 and then again we have the enquiry and correction as under Section 11 of the Act. Naturally it takes a considerable time. Of course, we do have cases where we have an understanding with the Syiems and the District Councils and the land owners for taking possessions of the lands. It is not only a question of advance possession of the lands, but is also a process of finding  out how we will pay afterwards, for in some cases where we have advance possession we have to go through  al the different processes. Now in Khasi Hills, perhaps it is a problem of greater magnitude than any other areas and also in the hilly regions of Garo Hills and the hilly regions of Jaintia Hills because of lack of record of rights and the maps showing  the ownership over lands and their correct measurement, all this takes quite a lot of time because of lack of these things. We have to tackle  the problem because  it is a matter of urgency to have a cadastral survey of records of rights to determine the right owners. In this District, we do have also authorities with whom we have to get along- we have local heads like the Syiems in the matter of finding out the right owners. But those local heads do not have records or documents with regard to the plots of land and in view of the fact that there are various plots of land, it involves a protected procedure to find out or determine the ownership. Then, as I have stated earlier, the work has increased ten-fold or even hundred -fold with the advancement of development works, both Central and State for construction of buildings, roads, etc. We have inherited the staff, a very small staff indeed, dealing  with this matter, and we cannot, over a year or so, recruit more people necessary for this work. For example, we have for the whole of Khasi Hills District, only 2 Sub Deputy Collectors for dealing with these land compensation matters. But we are now taking steps -the Public Service Commission also has notified- and we are going ahead with emergency recruitment of officers and we hope that within a short time, final selection of candidates can be done. But then, of course, they cannot be expected to be qualified persons and so they will have to undergo a training. Any way, the Revenue Department last year had released one or two officers from the Blocks. That is the situation. We have been able to send some of the officers to Garo Hills. We are also considering  release of more officers. We have now 3 more  officers. We have now 3 more qualified Sub-Deputy Collectors  who  are serving as Block Department Officers for the last few years. We are also considering to release them to the Revenue Department. Perhaps the situation might be improved. I would seek the indulgence and patience of the hon. Members that so far as we are concerned, when we take up this question, we have been very earnest. Last years we did release Sub-Deputy Collectors and this year we may release more. We have got also emergency recruitment. We will have within a year, after  training, sufficient numbers of officers to deal with this question and that would perhaps remove the back-log of 15 or 20 years within a few years time. So Sir, in view of this, I  would hope that the hon. Members would rest assured on that assurance and they will not bring up this question again because we are doing  our level best. As I stated earlier, we have gone for urgent recruitment and we hope that within  a short time we can release some more officers from the Block. With these few words, Sir, I request the hon. Mover to withdraw  his cut motion.

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, first of all since the Minister has referred to the extension of the Registration Act, I would request that before the Government consider for extension beyond the five mile radius from Shillong, it should  take us all into confidence. Secondly he has stated about the process of land acquisition that it will have to go strictly according to the provisions of that Act, and that is why it takes time. But then we have seen in certain  places compensation is paid within a year where as in other  cases even after 10 or 15 years the people have not been paid. So this is a discrimination. Sir, whatever we are to follow according to the provision of law, it should be equally  done and we should give more importance to all and every  field and not only in certain areas because it amounts to discrimination as the hon. Member from Mawlai has stated. But since the Minister has assured us that the Government will look into the matter and that more Sub-Deputy Collectors also would  be appointed to clear  up the backlog of the pending works, I withdraw the cut motion.

Shri S. D. Khongwir : Sir, I think his cut motion has been bracketed with my cut motion. So, before withdrawing, I would like to say that in the course of the reply made by the Hon'ble Minister, Revenue he has given a very important statement with regard to the legality of the registration of documents by the local administrative heads, but the local administrative heads carry with them no legal sanction. I think that is the correct statement. So I would appeal to the Government, through you, Sir, and to all that we should educate our own people because I have come across certain very brief experiences especially with regard to the people from the Bhoi area. At one time one person (old lady) came to me for a loan of Rs. 600.00 and when I asked the old lady the reason for the loan, she said that she had to pay to the local administrative head- to  a Syiem for registration of a document. Then, I assured her and I told her just like the Minister told just now that the local administrative head, the Syiem, had  got no authority  to register documents and I personally went to the officials of the Syiem and I told them that we cannot pay you this amount of Rs.600.00 for registration. Then he said for you we will make it Rs. 450.00. Then, I said - no nothing doing, we cannot pay you' . Later on, we came to the conclusion- alright, we will give you Rs. 100.00 but this Rs. 100.00 is not the fee for registration but please go and buy the best quality of cigarette in the market and take, tea as you like but remember that this is not the fee registration. So, now, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to appeal because we are being exploited because of our ignorance. Now the Government has come up with a statement, informing us that the local heads cannot registered. Of course, for registration on they should take nothing from the poor people the poor farmers and the agriculturists. It is alright if they pay a nominal fee of Rs. 5.00 or Rs. 10.00 but for Rs. 600.00 to be taken for registration of a paddy field of about 400 acres is too much.

        And then another point, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, is with a regard to payment of compensation. I would advocate that the Government should expedite disposal of those cases which have been pending for quite a long time say, 5,6,7, or 8 years old. We have got some very very old land acquisition proceedings some of them are 60 years old and some of them are even 70 years old. If these land acquisition proceedings will drag on for some more years, I think the land owners will have died by that time. So, if the Government can select at least the cases where very old people are involved and then try to finish the proceedings in respect of these  very old persons so that  they can enjoy the fruits after the proceedings are finalized- it is very  good, if the Government can do that. I can cite example as far as Mawlai is concerned. I can give  the list of very old persons, Sir. So at least they can finish these acquisition proceedings earlier so that those people, old people can enjoy the fruits of their very long waiting. In this respect we have not had the assurance from the Minister. Since he is an old friends of mine, I will go personally to him and give him the list of the persons that I have already mentioned and I hope he will assist us in this regard. So with these few words, I withdraw my Cut Motion.

Mr. Deputy Speaker : Has the hon. Members leave of the House to withdraw their Cut Motion?

(Voices - yes- yes).

The Cut Motions are in with leave of the House withdrawn. Now Mr. F. K. Mawlot to move his motion.

Shri F. K. Mawlot : Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the total provision of Rs.11,31,000 under the Grant No. 6, Major Head "229-Land Revenue",  at page 31 of the budget be reduced by Rs. 100.00 i.e., the amount  of the whole grant  of Rs. 11,31,000, do stand reduced by Rs. 100.

Mr. Deputy Speaker : Motion moved. Now, you can raise a discussion on the need of  Cadastral Survey of land of the whole State.

Shri F. K. Mawlot :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, much has been spoken about registration as well as compensation and so on by the Members and also we have heard a statement made by the Chief Minister. My intension in moving this Cut Motion is to urge upon the Government to take cognizance or to have a Cadastral Survey of the land of the State. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if you go all along the border with Bangladesh two years before and two years after, you  will find that there will be a small change somewhere, either by erosion or natural erosion or many artificial changes. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, not only in the border with Bangladesh but same is the case in the border of Meghalaya with Assam. For example, if you go to Amjong you will find  that there is one small stream and the boundary of our State, of our District Khasi Hills District is from that stream. But there is a pretty small flat land by the foot of the Hills, and that small flat land falls in Khasi Hills. You know some people from the other side who are the Revenue Officers of the Government of Assam, have encroached and taken procession of it. The small stream was blocked at the higher level diverting  the course of the stream by cutting  a small canal by the foot of the hill so that pretty small flat land falls within Assam. Sir, the Assam Government is very active and their officers are very active. I should praise them and they would claim that this portion or plot of land belongs to them and so the Revenue Department of Assam also claims and they at once issued pattas or whatever the case may be. So, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this Government does not know that these things take place and that we are losing our territory bit by bit. I doubt whether this Government knows the actual boundaries of the State. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, when Meghalaya  came into being, we thought that all the areas comprising of the areas in the erstwhile Khasi States would have been included or should have come over straightway to us to be part and parcel of Meghalaya.

(At this stage, the Speaker occupied the Chair).

    But it is regrettable to note that there are some portions of the erstwhile Khasi States which were not claimed by this benign Government. Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is also essential to have cadastral survey of  the land in the State. Because for example, if we want to do some agriculture and try to locate which are the areas feasible for the development of agriculture, and which are the areas which can produce more food and for other things also we need to know the places,  the prevailing  conditions of the area, and so on and so forth. So I urge upon the Government to start having a cadastral survey. I know that we have our own Meghalaya Survey as the Government of Assam do have their own Assam Surveys. The Assam Surveys is very  active whereas it is unfortunate to State here, that the Meghalaya Surveys or the Land Revenue Department is not at all active. It seems they are sleeping all the time.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to inform the hon. Member that there is vast difference  between the boundary survey and the cadastral survey.

Mr. Speaker : But at the same time they are interlinked as the land falls within the boundary of Meghalaya.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot : Therefore, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I urge upon the Government to start the cadastral survey. We should  at least know which part of the area falls within the Meghalaya State, and we have every  right to know it. And this will also help us to see that no outsider will dare to have an inch of our area. My intension here is that the Government should do the cadastral survey for its own benefit so that when there is gold mine or coal mine the Government can rush to that area so that we can do something; we can sell it out to this Company or that Company. But without having cadastral survey, how will the Government know whether  there is gold mine or lalpani and so on.

Mr. Speaker :- Then it is not a cadastral survey, it is geological survey.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :- My point is, Mr. Speaker, Sir........

Shri Humphrey Hadem : Mr. Speaker, Sir, it was learnt that persons from our State went to kynrshai and they were driven out by the people there.

Mr. Speaker : This is outside the subject matter.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, only a few words. The main object of the cut motion is about the need of the cadastral survey so that we may know the actual jurisdiction of our own State and the people also can rest assured about holding of their land and property. Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is a fact that our people near the border  of Bangladesh have been cultivating the land since 1958 or 1962, I mean our people in the foot hills of our State, near the border of Bangladesh. They have been cultivating  their plots of land since before the last boundary settlement of the country with the then Pakistan and since time immemorial they cultivating  their land. But during the last few years the Border Security Force of Bangladesh have asked our people to vacate the land that they have been cultivating till now. Therefore, I request  the Government to prepare......

Mr. Speaker : May I ask the Minister-in-charge whether the cadastral survey has been started ?

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Revenue) :-  Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is the subject matter of the Land Reforms Commission and they have been asked to take up the matter as early as possible.

Mr. Speaker :- I think  the hon. Member has raised the point on the need of the cadastral survey and not the other survey.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is unfortunate that our Government till now  has not started any survey.

Mr. Speaker : That is why this cut motion has been brought.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is high time for the Government to start this cadastral survey immediately. With these few words, I resume my seat.

Miscellaneous.

Mr. Speaker : Before I call upon the any other hon. Members, I would take the leave of the House to bring to its notice  one very important matter which to my mind, is really important. That is the most unfortunate incident that took place in the Allahabad High Court. As it is the concern of the whole country and also that concern of this House as well. I feel that at least we should make a reference to it in  this august House. As I have taken  the leave of the House to make this reference, and as you know that India is wedded to the best ideals of democracy and in order to observe the best tradition and the highest responsibility for the rule of law, the Prime Minister has shown her magnanimity by appearing in person in the Allah bad High Court, i.e., on the 18th. But  in the mean time  one young  man by the name of Govind Misra was arrested inside the premises of the High Court while he was making an attempt to enter into the Court room and I think we should commend the exemplary duties performed by the security personnel. I think we should also express our greatest concern about this attitude of a few individuals to disrupt  the rule of law  in this country and we should also express our sigh of relief that at least the Prime Minister was saved of what should have been a fatal incident in the country.  Although I do not really want to speak much, I would like to make a similar reference that only yesterday another attempt  was made on the life of the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court of India and luckily here also we have a sigh of relief once again that at least the attempt was thwarted. If the members agree I will express the concern of this House in a letter that I am going to write to the Prime Minister and I think it will be in the fitness of things that I also write to the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court expressing our concern on this matter. We look  forward to this Government to take adequate security measures on the life of the Prime Minister or the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court or any leaders of the country visiting out State at any time. I now invite any other hon. Members to associate with this concern on this incident. The Minister for Parliamentary Affairs may like to say a few words.

Shri B. B. Lyngdoh (Minister for Parliamentary Affairs) : Mr. Speaker, Sir, as you have very  very correctly stated, this matter should be of grave concern to every citizen of India who cherishes and believes in democracy and in the rule of law. Force  and violence are contradictions to our ideals of democracy and the rule of law. As rightly remarked by yourself, Mr. Speaker, Sir, the very noble act of the Prime Minister to go from her high  Office in Delhi to appear in person like any ordinary or common citizen to subject herself to the procedure of law in the court to be cross-examined for two days shows her conviction and belief in the rule of law. Therefore, if on that very action of hers, there should be any person or group of persons who would try to endanger and cause harm to her, it is the very negation of our ideals in the country and it should really  be the concern of all of us. Therefore, I would associate myself wholeheartedly with this reference and I would also support the suggestion that out Hon'ble Speaker, would express the concern of all of us by addressing a letter to the Prime Minister. So also with the other incident similar to that of the Prime Minister when at attempt on the life of the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court which is the guardian of the legal and  fundamental rights of the citizens and also the guardian of the rule of law, was made and within the same week these two incidents took place. I should say that it is a very serious incident and it should be the duty of all citizens that we rise and voice our protest against these elements, these ideals and thoughts that may disrupt the country so that we can nib them in the bud. We should stand united  and flourish as a free country where the rule of law could prevail. Thank you, Sir.

Shri Maham Singh : Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also fully support  the proposal made by you that we would made a reference with regard to this matter. Mr. Speaker, Sir,  as has been rightly observed by you, this is a matter of grave concern, a matter of grave concern not only to the members of this august House but it is a matter of grave concern to the whole country of ours. Mr. Speaker, Sir, it was only a few days ago that in this very House, we have passed condolence and paid our homage to one leader who was brutally and politically assassinated. Sir, the time another attempt has been made to assassinate our Prime Minister, Mrs. Indira Gandhi, who holds the highest office in this land. We admire.......

Mr. Speaker : Highest office in the Government.

Shri Maham Singh : We admire her that in spite of the fact that there was an attempt on her life on the first day of hearing of the case but that did not dissuade her from attending on the second day. On the second day she gave evidence in the open court, Sir, this news has come as a great shock to all piece loving people. It has come as a great shock to all peace loving people. It has come as a great shock to all lovers of freedom and democracy. So we condemn these acts in the strongest words.  We condemn all those anti-social elements we condemn all those people who have taken to violence  in order to achieve their mischievous aims; we condemn them in the strongest terms and I feel that we must fight against these forces of violence with firmness and with determination. Mr. Speaker, Sir, equally I would support the reference to be made, as has been suggested  by you, of the attempt on the person of the Chief Justice of India, a man who is holding the highest office in the Judiciary. According to me and to others as well we look to them as the protectors of the freedom of the people. So, Mr. Speaker, Sir,  I fully agree that we should make a reference to the Prime Minister and the Chief Justice of India and we wish that God will continue to protect them in their life and may they live for many more years  to serve the people in our country. With these few words, Sir, I resume my seat.

Shri Hopingstone Lyngdoh :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I also would like to associate myself with the reference made by you before this august House. It is a matter of grave concern, Sir. that we have to make two references on the attempt to assassinate the two  great personalities of this land and this, Sir, indicates the present mentality of people pt certain individuals in this country to disrupt democracy of India. It is very unfortunate to hear that there are such elements who are responsible for such a attempt to assassinate our beloved Prime Minister and the Chief Justice  of India. Mr. Speaker, Sir, through these reference we strongly  condemn the elements who have attempted to disrupt democracy in our country. Sir,. I therefore, support the move suggested by you in this behalf.

ADJOURNMENT

Mr. Speaker : The House stands adjourned till 9.00 A. M. on Saturday, the 22nd March, 1975.

R. T. RYMBAI

Dated Shillong,

Secretary ,

The 21st March, 1975.

Meghalaya Legislative Assembly.