Proceedings of the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly held at 9.30 A.M. on Friday, the 2nd April, 1976 in the Assembly Chamber, Shillong.

Present :- Mr. Speaker in the Chair, 8 Ministers, 2 Ministers of State and 37 Members.

Mr. Speaker :- Let us take up unstarred Question.


UNSTARRED QUESTIONS

(Replies to which were laid on the Table)

Shifting of Jowai Distillery

Shri H.E. Pohshna asked :-

95. Will the Minister in charge of Excise be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the public of Jowai Town in their memorandum dated the 14th February, 1976 have requested the Government for the immediate shifting of Jowai Distillery from Umshyngiar, Jowai?

(b)

If so, what action has been taken on the matter?

(c) Whether it is a fact that the farmer Excise Minister had given an assurance for its shifting in a meeting of public leaders at District Council Hall?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) replied :

(a)

- Yes.

(b)

- The representation is under examination.

(c) - The former Excise Minister had only discussion on the matter in the meeting.

Shri H. Hadem : (c). Whether it is a fact that huge amount of compensation will be involved in the proposed shifting of Jowai distillery?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Yes, it will involve.

Shri Maham Singh :- Compensation to the land owners or to whom?

Mr. Speaker :- It is not mentioned in the main question. You are asking a supplementary question to a supplementary question. That is not allowed.

Bonded Warehouse

Shri H.E. Pohshna asked :

96. Will the Minister of Excise be pleased to state -

(a)

The names of Bonded Warehouses in the State of Meghalaya?

(b)

Names of the retailers for foreign liquors?

(c) The name of the bar licenses for foreign liquors?
(d) The names of vendors and country spirit shops in the State?
(e) The names of the distillery licenses of Umshyngiar during the year ending 31st December, 1973 and 31st December 1975?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister of Excise) replied :

96 (a)- (i) M/S Mohan Meakin Breweries, Ltd.     

            (ii) M/S Meghalaya Bonded Warehouse. 

      (b)    Khasi Hills.  

1. Shri J. Choudhury.
2. Shri K.T. Malwani. 
3. Shri. S.C. Choudhury. 
4. Shri. S.M. Roy. 
5. Shrimati D. Khongwir.
6. Shri and Shrimati B.N. Banerjee. 
7. Shri R.L. Singhania. 
8. Shrimati B. Nongkynrih. 
9. Shri P.R. Warjri.
10. Shrimati P. Diengdoh. 
11. Honorary Secretary, Shillong  Club (Club license).
12.  Manager, Pinewood Hotel (Hotel license).
13. Manager, Peak Hotel (Hotel license) 
Jaintia Hills

1.

Gowell Laloo.
Garo Hills

1. 

Shri Nishi Kanta Deb.

2. 

Shrimati Sylvia Momin. 

3. 

Shri Joylance G. Momin. 
(c)-  Khasi Hills 
1. Shrimati P.V. Hauner. 
2. Shrimati P. Saigal. 
3. Shrimati C. Lyngwa. 
4. Shri Cheeyaun Sang. 
5. Shri S.K. Das. 
6. Shri B. Marbaniang. 
7. Shrimati Mary Loius Kharmawphlang. 
Garo Hills
1. Shri Cedric A. Sangma. 
(d) -  Khasi Hills.
1. Shri Biren Pde. 
2. Shri Biren Pde, 
3. Shri Saron Challam. 
Jaintia Hills
1. Shri Konil Lato.
2. Shri Pholney Suchiang. 
3. Shri Jendrowell Sungoh. 
4. Shri Hed Dkhar. 
Garo Hills
1. Shri Donald Roy. 
2. Shri M.B. Newar. 
3. Shri Tohil Sangma.
4. Shri Jitendra Sangma. 
5. Shri Bhubaneswar Rai.
6.  Shri Lakshmi K.Momin. 
7. Shri Jaichand Marak. 
8. Shri Ramesh Saha. 
9. Shri Harka Bahadur Gurung. 

(e)- Upto 31st December 1973-

1. Shrimati Ruphi Najiar.

2. Shrimati Thij Passah.

3. Shrimati Syntu Niangti.

4. Shrimati Promila Kyndiah. 

5. Shrimati Kongka Pyrbot. 
6. Shrimati Ormai Lakiang 
7. Shrimati Timai Bareh. 
8. Shrimati Phisida Laloo. 
9. Shri Khro Laloo
10. Shrimati Bilti Lakiang.
11. Shrimati Synshar Shullai. 
12. Shrimati Mephi Laloo.
13. Shrimati Syntu Sumer. 
14. Shrimati Moilin Passah. 
15. Shrimati Emily Niangti. 
16. Shrimati Khiarimai Kyndiah. 
Upto 31st December, 1975- 
1. Shrimati Ruphi Najiar. 
2. Shrimati Thij Passah. 
3. Shrimati Promila Kyndiah. 
4. Shrimati Syntu Niangti.
5. Shrimati Kongka Pyrbot. 
6. Shrimati Ormai Lakiang 
7. Shrimati Timai Bareh. 
8. Shrimati Phisida Laloo. 
9. Shri Khro Laloo.
10. Shrimati Bilty Lakiang.
11. Shrimati Synshar Shullai. 
12. Shrimati Mephi Laloo.
13. Shrimati Syntu Sumer. 
14. Shrimati Moilin Passah.
15. Shrimati Emily Niangti. 
16. Shrimati Khiarimai Kyndiah. 
17. Shri Riang Sumer.
18. Shrimati Meldis Passah. 
19. Shrimati Miriam Sumer. 

Shri G. Mylliemngap : Is there any thinking of having any licence bar in Jaintia Hills?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) : Not yet, Mr. Speaker, Sir. 

Shri H. Hadem (c) : Whether Serial (4) is an Indian citizen?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise ) :He has acquired Indian citizenship. 

Shri H. Hadem (c) : Whether inspection of the retailers, shops had been made by the  Excise staff?

Mr. Speaker : Inspection for what?

Shri H. Hadem : Of  the stores concerned they have in their shops. 

Mr. Speaker : That is their normal routine duty. Is it a fact that the Government does not send the Excise staff to inspect the stores of the bar licences?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise ) : No Sir, it is not a fact. 

Shri G. Mylliemngap : (c) : Is there any possibility of increasing the number of licensed bars?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise ) : Not now, Mr. Speaker, Sir. We have decided not to increase the bar licenses. 

Shri Jormanik Syiem 96 : (d) . Whether the lease to the 3 vendors is still continuing after the 31st March in Khasi Hills?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise ) : Yes their licences are valid upto March, 1978.     

Shri Jormanick Syiem : All the three, may I know? 

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise ) : Yes, all the three. 

Terracing Scheme in Jaintia Hills 

Shri L. Bareh asked : 

97. Will the Minister-in-charge of Soil Conservation be pleased to state-

(a) When was the terracing scheme started and implemented in Jaintia Hills?
(b) The areas included or sector so far started under each scheme?
(c) The amount so far spent in each sector or area ?
(d) The number of  families benefitted from the schemes?
(e) Whether all the areas covered by the said schemes are suitable for permanent cultivation.
(f) Whether it is a fact that Lumshnong areas under Mutang sector are not suitable for permanent cultivation and no crops can be grown.
(g) The amount spent at Mutang sector and when?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister of Soil Conservation) replied :

97. (a)- Terracing works done in Jaintia Hills since 1970-71.   

      (b)- (i) Subsidy Scheme.

        Subsidies at 80 percent of the estimated cost (varying according to slope per cent) were paid to the bonafide cultivators of the following villages who have actually done terracing works under the supervision of the Officers of this Department in their respective jurisdiction.

1. Jowai Soil  Conservation Range (during 1970-71 and 1971-72, this Range covered the whole of Jaintia Hills District).

1970-71 ... ... .. 295.21 hectares;
1971-72 ... ... ... 256.67      "
1972-73 ... ... ... 112.70      "
1973-74 ... ... ...   91.20      "
1974-75 ... ... ...    17.05     "
Total ... ... ... 772.83      "

Names of villages :

        Jowai, Rakabah, Kdiap, Nongumlieh, Mobakhon, Mawdoh, Nartiang, Mynsgat, Nongrim, Bambthong, Nongkharai, Moodoh, Khlieh Tyrshi, Bamkamar, Ummulong, Larnai, Amntapoh, Amloren, Kharkana Kudengthymmai, Khonglah, Amjalong, Pdy, Masku, Nongtalang Model, Remusa, Sohkha - Mission, Sohkha-Phlong, Kudongrim, Sohphoh Kdohkulai, Mawdymmai, Mudur Ummluh, Jungshukut, Thatmusem. Nongthoh, Nongkhawa, Mukhla, Wahiajer.

2. Khliehriat Soil Conservation Range (this range came into being only in 1972-73).

1972-73 ... ... ...  75.55 hectares
1973-74 ... ... ...  90.54      "
1974-75 ... ... ...     6.75     "
Total ... ... ... 172.84      "

        Name of villages :

        Khliehriat, Mopala, Jarian, Dingsumrim, Tule, Nongkhlieh, Laterke, Sutnga, Pohshning, Mohkynpah, Umlawang, Myndi, Hati, Ummat, Lama, Umkboh, Kairang, Saipung, Lumpabhoi, Lumshken, Diengchalalu, Suchen Musiang, Musngiangringmailong, Dkhih, Rymbai, Nongthymmai, Khardong, Bataw, Mullieh, Myntung, Mulet, Brisumar, Jalaphet, Lamarsiang, Mynthlu, Byrwai, Sohkynphor, Tangnup, Kynluh, Iapmala, Warwan Sakhain, Tongnup, Umladoh.

3. Lumshnong Soil Conservation Beat :

1973-74 ... ... ... 43.50 hectares
1974-75 ... ... ...   Nil         "
Total ... ... ... 43.50      "

        Name of villages :

        Lumshnong, Musiang Lamara, Shnongpyrdi, Mynkre, Umkiang, Nongsning, Sonapur, Kuliang, Tangskai, Pyrthakuna, Champlong, Tongseng, Wahjajer, etc., etc.

        Grant Total :- Subsidy Scheme - 988.67 hectares.

(ii)    At full rate as demonstration :

1. Jowai S.C. Range :

1973-74 ... ... ...  4 hectares.
1974-75 ... ... ...  9 hectares
Total ... ... ... 13 hectares

2. Khliehriat S.C. Range :

        Nil.

3. Lumshnong S.C. Beat :

1973-74 ... ... ...  18.92 hectares.
1974-75 ... ... ...  17.00      "
Total ... ... ... 35.92      "

Grant Total (Full Rate) - 49.92 hectares.

        Name of villages :

        Bamkamar, Sohkha, Ummulong, Amlarem, Nartiang, Ratabah, Khonglah, Sohphoh, Sutnga, Rymbai, Shangpung Musiang, Lamare, Shnong Pyrdi, Wahjajer Khaidong, Bataw, Mulieh, Mopapla, Lumshong, Mutang, Tongseng, Pyrthakuna, Mynthlu, Umlawant, Umkiang, etc., etc.

        (iii)    Jhum Control Scheme (1074-75 only) :

1. Jowai S.C. Range -  50 hectares
2. Khliehriat S.C. Range -  80      "
3. Lumshsnong S.C. Beat -  75      "     

Total

-  205    "

        Name of villages :

        Umladang, Saipung, Lura, Saphak, Mualhoiu, Thuruk Mynkre, Musianglamare.

        (c) - The amount spent so far in the respective areas on terracing is a shown below :

        (i) Subsidy Scheme :

1. Range Officer, Jowai S.C. Range :

                 Rs.    P.

1970-71 - 1,75,070.00
1971-72 - 1,52,220.00
1972-73 - 66,780.50
1973-74 - 55,548.00
1974-75 - 15,000.00

Total

- 4,64,618.50

2. Khliehriat S.C. Range :

                  Rs.    P.

1972-73 - 55,953.00
1973-74 - 55,000.00
1974-75 - 10,000.00

Total

- 1,20,953.00

3. Beat Officer, Lumshnong S.C. Beat :

Rs.    P.

1973-74 - 55,000.00

 Grand Total (Subsidy)

- 1,20,953.00

        (ii) At Full Rate :

1. Jowai S.C. Range -

Rs.    P.

1973-74 - 13,500.00
1974-75 - 22,500.00

Total

- 36,000.00

2. Khliehriat S.C. Range -

        Nil.

3. Lumshnong S.C. Beat -

Rs.    P.

1973-74 - 48,340.00
1974-75 - 42,207.50

Total

- 90,547.50
Grand total (full rate) - Rs.1,26,547.50

        (iii) Jhum Control Scheme (1974-75) only

       Rs.    P
1. Jowai S.C. Range - 1,06,905.00
2. Khliehriat S.C. Range - 1,63,623.32
3. Lumshnong Beat - 1,50,000.00

Total (J.S Scheme)

- 4,20,528.32

        (d) - (i) Subsidy Scheme (1972-73 to 1974-75)

  Nos.
1. Jowai S.C. Range -  731
2. Khliehriat S.C. Range -  483
3. Lumshnong S.C. Beat -    81 

Total

- 1,295

        (ii) At Full rate :

  Nos.
1. Jowai S.C. Range -     8
2. Khliehriat S.C. Range -     -
3. Lumshnong S.C. Beat -    18 

Total

-  26

        (iii) Jhum Control Scheme :

  Nos.
1. Jowai S.C. Range -  25
2. Khliehriat S.C. Range -  40
3. Lumshnong S.C. Beat -  37

Total

- 120

        (e) - Yes.

        (f) - No. 

        (g) - Rupees 45,249.50 P. (Rupees forty five thousand two hundred forty-nine and paise fifty only during 1974-75.

Shri G. Mylliemngap (b) :- Under this subsidised scheme, how many families have been benefited?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Soil Conservation) :- It is replied at (d) in the main question.

Retirement of employees in District Branches of the Industries Department.

Shri R. Lyngdoh asked :

98. Will the Minister in charge of Industries, etc, be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether it is a fact that a number of employees in District Branches of the Industries Department had gone on retirement without pension benefit?

(b)

If so, the reasons and number of such persons?

Shri S.D.D. Nichols Roy (Minister, Industries) replied :-

98.(a)

- No.

(b)

- Does not arise.

Shri G. Mylliemngap : (a) Is it a fact that temporary hands under the District branches of the Industries Department were also given pension benefit?

Shri S.D.D. Nichols Roy (Minister, Industries) :- I will require notice for that.

Arrest of a culprit at Phlang Mawsyrpah

Shri K.M. Roy Marbaniang asked :

99. Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the Police Personnel who recently arrested a culprit at Phlang Mawsyrpah was fully-drunk, as a result of which the culprit ran away with the hand-cuff?

(b)

What action has been taken against the Police Personnel for their drunkenness during duty hours?

(c)

Whether Government is aware that the said culprit has become a terror in the locality after he slipped away from the Police?

(d)

If so, what steps have been taken to re-apprehend him?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :-

99. (a)

- It is a fact that a culprit ran away with hand-cuffs, but the Police Personnel concerned were not drunk.

(b)

- Does not arise in view of (a) above. However, they have been placed under suspension for negligence of their duties

(c)

- No such report has been received by the Government.

(d)

- The Officer in charge, Mawsynram Police Station, has been instructed to take all steps for his re-apprehension.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- (a). May we know, under what circumstances did he escape?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Sir, unfortunately, though the Police Station exists at Mawsynram, there was no lock up. This culprit was kept in the hajat and from there he escaped.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- (b) Whether this suspension has anything to do with the escape of the culprit?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- They have been placed under suspension for negligence of duty.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- May we know the name of the culprit?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. I.D. Khongwir.

Shri H. Hadem :- (d). Whether it is a fact that so far this culprit has not been reapprehended?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Attempt is being made to reapprehend this culprit.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- What did he escape?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- On the 17th or 18th January 1976.

Development of Tourism in the State

Shri D. Lyngdoh asked :

100. Will the Minister in charge of Tourism be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether the Government has prepared a Master Plan for the alround development of Tourism in the State?

(b)

If the reply to (a) above be in the affirmative the names of all the existing beauty spots and other places of historical importance included in the Master Plan and the purpose of development, as on 31st January 1976?

(c)

How far the Master Plan for the infrastructure of the Barapani Tourism Complex has progressed?

(d)

Whether it is a fact that the Government propose to provide some facilities with good drinking water supply, etc., to visitors in most attractive picnic spots such as Barapani lake area, Lovers' Paradise (Khanapara area), Jakrem Hot Spring area?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) replied :

100.(a)

- We have not prepared any Master Plan for the whole State of Meghalaya.

(b)

- Does not arise.

(c)

- The Master Plan for Barapani Tourism Complex is still under preparation. The Department has taken over one of the buildings belonging to M.S.E.B. to be run as a model. Renovation works of the above mentioned building is progressing.

(d)

- Government have not proposed to supply good drinking water to picnic spots at present.

Shri Dlosingh Lyngdoh :- (c) When has the building been taken over by the Tourism Department?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- Recently Mr. Speaker, Sir,

Shri G. Mylliemngap : (c) Any compensation for the building?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- I will require notice for that.

Allotment of Rice and Atta from the Central Pool

Shri Rowell Lyngdoh asked :

101. Will the Minister-in-charge of Supply be pleased to state -

(a)

The number of F.P. Shops which were not issued rations during the winter months (District-wise) ?

(b)

The quantity of rice and atta so saved from the above F.P. Shops?

(c)

The quantity of rice and atta received monthly by the State from the Central Pool during the year 1975-76?

Shri Edwingson Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) replied :

101.(a)
 - (i) Khasi Hills - 344 Nos
   (ii) Garo Hills - 135 Nos.
  (iii) Jaintia Hills - during the year 1975-76 rations were issued to all F.P. Shops in Jaintia Hills District throughout the year. Some centres in the rural areas did not, however, lift their quota regularly for some months.
(b)
- (i) Khasi Hills -  Rice - 7,847.87 Qtls.
Atta - 5,429 bags.
 (ii) Garo Hills - Rice - 7,611 Qtls
Atta - 1,114 bags.
 (iii) Jaintia Hills - there was no saving as the quota during winter season was also reduced.
(c)

- The quantity of rice and wheat should allotted monthly from the Central Pool during the year 1975-76 is a follows -

Month

 Rice

 Wheat

April 1975 - 3500 M.T. - 2000 M.T.
May 1975 - 3500 M.T - 2000 M.T
June 1975 - 3500 M.T - 3000 M.T.
July 1975 - 3500 M.T - 3000 M.T.
August 1975 - 3500 M.T -

3000 M.T.

September 1975 - 3500 M.T -

3000 M.T.

October 1975 - 3500 M.T -

3000 M.T.

November 1975 - 3500 M.T - 3000 M.T.
December 1975 - 3500 M.T - 3000 M.T.
January 1976 - 3500 M.T - 1600 M.T
February 1976 - 3500 M.T - 1600 M.T.

Total

- 38,500 M.T    - 28,200 M.T   

Shri S.D. Khongwir (a) :- May we know the reasons for non-issuing of rations ?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- This is in the interior because most of them are cultivators and after the harvest, they have got their own paddy.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- What are the winter months?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- November, December, January and February.

Shri S.P. Swer :- (e) May we know the scale of rice and atta issued per week per adult?

Mr. Speaker :- That is a new question.

Shri S.P. Swer : (a) May we know the reasons for such a vast difference in the number of fair price shops in Khasi Hills District and Garo Hills District.

Mr. Speaker :- What is the reason for the difference in the number of fair price shop dealers?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- The amount saved and not the amount issued.

Shri S.P. Swer :- Why there is so much difference?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- The amount saved and the quantity issued.

Shri S.P. Swer :- The quantity of rice and atta saved in the Khasi Hills District and the quality saved in Garo Hills District are almost equal. Why the number of fair price shops is so big a gap of difference?

Mr. Speaker :- That is hypothetical.

Shri W. Syiemiong :- (a) What are the reasons for non-issue of rice in Jaintia Hills.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- I will require notice for that.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- With whom the saved rice is stocked?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- With the agents of the Districts.

Shri W. Syiemiong :- Whether the order of suspension for issue of rations is a result of the Cabinet decision or the District officers concerned?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- That is the local arrangement.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- What are the circumstances or the criteria for deciding to stop issue or rice?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- That is depending on local enquiry conducted by the District officers.

Shri W. Syiemiong :- May we get a clarification, what does the Minister mean by local arrangement?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- By the District authority.

Shri Jormanick Syiem :- What was the reason for stopping issuing of ration to certain fair price shops?

Mr. Speaker :- It has already been answered.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- (c) What is the monthly requirement of rice?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Food and Civil Supplies) :- I have no information. I will have to calculate the average.

Inter-District boundaries

Shri Samarendra Sangma asked :

102. Will the Minister in charge of Revenue be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether the inter-district boundaries within the State of Meghalaya are clearly demarcated or not?

(b)

Whether the inter-State boundaries comprising the areas of "B" Mahal in Garo Hills and the State of Assam are clearly demarcated or not?

(c)

If not, when action will be taken by the Government for actual demarcation?

Shri Brington Buhai Lyngdoh (Minister-in-charge of Revenue) replied :

102.(a)

- No.

(b)

- Yes.

(c)

- In respect of inter-District boundaries, it is considered not necessary at present.

Amount sanctioned under the most Backward Scheme

Shri Brojendro Sangma asked :

103. Will the Minister-in-charge of Education be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the amount of Rs.30,000 (Rupees thirty thousand) has already been sanctioned and sanctioning order issued to the Moheskhola Government Aided M.E. School, under the most Backward Scheme during the year 1975-76?

(b)

If so, whether the amount has been utilised?

(c)

If so, the reason thereof ?

Shri P.G. Marbaniang (Minister of State in-charge of Education) replied :

103.(a)

- No.

(b) & (c)

- Do not arise.

"Correctional Home" and "Delinquent Children"

Shri M.N. Majaw asked :

104. Will the Minister in charge of Education be pleased to refer to Government Notification No.SW/SD.2/75/50, published in the Gazette of Meghalaya on February 1976 and state -

(a)

What the Education Department means by a "Correctional Home" and "Delinquent Children"?

(b)

Whether Government is aware of the fact that the universally accepted official terms should be a "certified institution" or a "juvenile home and juvenile or adolescent delinquents"?

(c)

Whether the proposed home at Sohiong now enjoys the following facilities : (i) running water (ii) electricity, and (iii) adequate number of bathrooms?

(d)

How far away from Shillong is this proposed home?

(e)

How far away is this Home from the main road of Sohiong?

(f)

Whether there is motorable approach road to this home?

(g)

How many juveniles will be accommodated at the home?

(h)

How many of them are (i) under trial prisoners, and (ii) convicts?

(i) Whether the State Government will set up Juvenile Courts at the Home near Sohiong and will the Juvenile be brought to Shillong?
(j) Whether the State Government has appointed trained and qualified persons to preside over such Juvenile Courts?
(k) Whether the State Government has secured orders from the concerned Courts for transfer of these Juveniles from the Shillong District Jail to the 'Home' at Sohiong?

Shri P.G. Marbaniang (Minister of State in charge of Education)  replied :

104.(a)

- As a first step towards enforcement and implementation of the provision of the Assam Children's Act, 1970 in the State, the State Governments is establishing a Correctional Home where it is proposed to provide for all the requirements under the Act envisaged under sections 9, 10 and 11 of the Act.
          A delinquent child is a definite under section 2(2) of the Act as a child who has been found to have committed an offence.

(b)

- No.

(c)

- Steps are taken to provide these facilities.

(d)

- About 32 Km. on the Shillong-Sohiong-Umsaw Road.

(e)

- About 2 Km. from the Shillong-Mairang Road.

(f)

- Yes?

(g)

- 25

(h)

- This will be known when the Home actually starts functioning and admission of inmates has taken place.

(i)

(j) & (k) - The provisions of the Act will be followed in due course.

Construction of road from Chepara to Purakhasia

Shri Samarendra Sangma  asked :

105. Will the Minister in charge of Public Works Department be pleased to state -

(a)

The number of workers employed for construction of the road from Chepara to Purakhasia on the Ampati-Salmanpara-Purakhasia Public Works Department Road?

(b)

When will the road construction works in the said portion from Cherapara to PuraKhasia be completed?

(c)

When will the said road be opened for public vehicles?

Shri P.R. Kyndiah (Minister, Public Works Department) replied :

105.(a)

- Two hundred labourers on an average per day when work is in full swing.

(b)

- Expected to be completed by March 1977.

(c)

- Expected to be open by March 1977.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :- (b) What is the total length of the road?

Shri P.R. Kyndiah (Minister, Public Works Department) :- I will require notice, Sir.

Opening of Licensed distillery at Khliehriat

Shri L. Bareh asked :

106. Will the Minister in charge of Excise be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether it is a fact that the people of Khliehriat and Dkhiat including the Doloi of Rymbai strongly opposed the opening of licenced distillery at Khliehriat?

(b)

Whether the Government received a representation in the form of a resolution passed in the Durbar opposing the same?

(c)

If so, what steps the Government has taken in the matter so far?

(d)

Whether the Government is aware of the fact that the said distillery is located just by the National Highway (Jowai-Badarpur Road) and very near to the L.P. School and just in front of the Khliehriat Border Road Organisation Office?

(e)

Whether it is a fact that all the tea stalls at Khliehriat are agents for selling liquor for the said distillery?

(f)

If not, whether the excise inspecting staff had ever made any surprise raid at the said centre?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) replied :

106. (a) - No distillery license was granted.
(b), (c), (d) (e) and (f) - Do not arise.

Provision of furniture, etc., to Inspection Bungalows

Shri H.E. Pohshna asked :

107. Will the Minister in charge of P.W.D. be pleased to state -  

(a)

How many Inspection Bungalows have been provided with new carpets, window purdahs, furniture during the year 1975-76 under the following Divisions -

(i) Jowai Division;
(ii) North Jowai Division;
(iii) Shillong South Division; and
(iv) Shillong North Division?
(b)

The names of the suppliers for each Inspection Bungalow and the amount paid for each supplies?

Shri P.R. Kyndiah (Minister, Public Works Department) replied :

107.(a)

- Two Inspection Bungalows under South Jowai Division have been provided with new furniture, carpets and window purdahs during the year 1975-76.

(ii) Two Inspection Bungalows that have been provided with door and window purdahs only during the year 1975-76.
(iii) Nil.
(iv) Nil.
(b)

- The list is placed on the Table of the House.

Division of assets and liabilities between Assam and Meghalaya State Electricity Board.

Prof. M.N. Majaw asked :

108. Will the Minister in charge of Power be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether assets and liabilities have been proportionately divided between the Assam and Meghalaya State Electricity Board?

(b)

If so, - (i) What is the amount of both assets and liabilities apportioned to the Meghalaya State Electricity Board?
(ii) On what basis was this division made?
(iii) The list of such assets and liabilities have been apportioned to Meghalaya?

Shri S.D.D. Nichols Roy (Minister Power) replied :

108 (a) - A provisional apportionment has been done.

(b) - (i) and (ii) All fixed assets and related field offices and their assets located in Meghalaya and related current liabilities have been apportioned to Meghalaya State Electricity Board on location basis. As the balance sheet as on the date of bifurcation of the old Assam State Electricity Board has not been finalised, the exact amount of the assets cannot be stated now.

        The amount of loan liability provisionally apportioned to Meghalaya State Electricity Board is 33 per cent of the total liabilities of the old Assam State Electricity Board, comes to Rs.37.56 crores. It has been presumed by the Government of India for this purpose that 33 per cent of the assets of the old Assam State Electricity Board would stand transferred to Meghalaya State Electricity Board.

        (iii) A complete list will be difficult and bulky to readily furnished. However copies of the Orders of the Government of India, dated 20th January 1975 and 19th March 1975 are placed on the Table of the House.

        The list of liabilities transferred are as follows :-

Loan liabilities

Loan liabilities Total 33 per cent Share

Rs       P

             Rs.        P

(i) Loan from Government of Assam, Meghalaya and Mizoram

78,57,42,489.04

25,92,95,021.38

(ii) Public Loan by issue of bonds

26,67,47,900.00

  8,80,26,807.00

(iii) Loan from L.I.C.

  8,58,00,000.00

  2,83,14,000.00


Grand Total

1,13,82,90,389.04

37,56,35,828.38


Shri H. Hadem :- (b) When will the final apportionment take place?

Shri S.D.D Nichols Roy (Minister Power) :- It is in the process and we cannot say when it will be completed.

Shri G. Mylliemngap B (ii) :- On these liabilities to be appointed to the Government of Meghalaya at 33 percent, may I know how much it will come to?

Mr. Speaker :- It is there in the next page.

Apportionment of records, documents, etc., between Assam and Meghalaya

Shri M.N. Majaw asked :

109. Will the Minister be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether all the files, records, documents and other parts outstanding between the Government of Meghalaya and Assam have been apportioned in the last few months?

(b)

If so, do these papers and documents relate to matters concerning the boundary between Meghalaya and Assam?

(c)

If not, why not?

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

109.(a)

- The work is in progress.

(b)

- Yes, some of them do.

(c)

- Does not arise.

Shri H. Hadem (b) :- Under whole procession are these documents at present?

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I think the hon. Member should realise that this State of ours was formed after carving out two Districts from Assam and naturally the records are with Assam.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- Is there any separate cell for this purpose?

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Yes, Sir.

Shri Maham Singh (a) :- Is it a fact that most of the records and documents are generally taken away to Gauhati?

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- No, Sir, except some important documents pertaining to Political Department are taken away and the rest are here in Shillong.

Shri G. Mylliemngap (a) :- Who is the man immediately in-charge of the cell?

Mr. Speaker :- What is the designation of the officer-in-charge of that separate cell?

Shri Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- There is a cell under the general supervision of the Commissioner of Divisions and under whom there are a number of officers.

Shri F.K. Mawlot :- How many officers are under the Commissioner of Divisions?

Mr. Speaker :- That is supplementary to supplementary.

Tourists festivals in Shillong

Shri D. Lyngdoh asked :

110. Will the Minister in charge of Tourism be pleased to state -

104.(a)

The total revenue collected from the last two Tourists festivals in Shillong (year wise) ?

(b)

The amount spent for the organisation of the said two festivals (year wise)?

(c)

Whether Government derive any revenue from the Tourist Lodge in Shillong?

(d)

If so, the amount received during the last 3 years (year wise)?

(e)

The net income derived from all the mini-buses placed under the Department of Tourism during, the last 2 (two) years, after deducting the cost of POL, drivers pay and T.A.?

(f)

Whether the improvement works in the Thadlaskein Lake in Jaintia Hills have been completed?

(g)

The total expenditure for the improvement of the Thadlaskein Lake, including the boat house, boats and other connected houses?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) replied :

110.(a)

- Two festivals were held during the year 1975-76, i.e., the month of May 1975, and October 1975, revenue derived from these two festivals were as follows :-

(a) Beat Contest - Rs.4,000.00
(b) Fishing Competition - Rs.201.00
(c) Manipur Dance - Rs.1,161.00
(b)

- The amount spent during the festivals are as follows :-

1. Spring Festival - Rs.51,513.00
2. Autumn Festival - Rs.49,400.00
(c)

- Yes.

(d)

- The amount received during the last 3 years from Shillong Tourist Bungalow -

(a) 1973-74 - Rs.10,188.00. The Assam type of Tourist Bungalow was taken over by this Department of Assam Government on 14th November 1973 and hence the collection in 1973-74 is fo 4 months.
(b) 1974-75 - Rs.423,139.00
(c) 1975-76 - Rs.49,226.00
(e)

- Net income derived for the last two years from Mini-buses fare -
     1974 - Rs.14,000.00
     1975 - Rs.  5,862.00

(f)

- So far as improvement works in Thadlaskein Lake in Jaintia Hills are concerned, the following are the improvement works taken up and completed :-

1. Barbed wires fencing around the lake.
2. Construction of an approach Road to the Tourist Bungalow opposite the lake.
3. Construction of a culvert and a slab drain.
4. Repairs of the Lavatory near the old Boat house.
5. Completion of construction of Boat House in the Thadlaskein lake.
6. Construction of bamboo spurs and quardwall around the lake for the prevention of erosion.
7. The construction of Tourist Bungalow at Thadlaskein is in progress and expected to be completed soon.
8. Boats have been placed in the lake and are already for operation.
(g)

- A total of Rs.2.47 (Rupees two lakhs forty seven thousand) has been spent till date.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- Whether any profit was derived from these two festivals

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, the reply to 110 (a) is in case of the amount that has been received and on top of that, it will not be possible for Government to calculate the benefit that might have accrued to the State because promotion of tourism is not undertaken with a view to earn direct revenue to the State Exchequer. But tourism only helps to bring it invisible earnings.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- Is the income accrued from the mini-buses after working out the depreciation of motor cars?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- No, Sir.

Shri F.K. Mawlot :- Just now the Minister has replied that the Government is not in a position to assess the benefit derived from these festivals. But in the reply it is Stated 'yes'. May we know what is the exact position?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- The first question pertains to the amount that we have earned as profit from festivals. The present question refers to (c) which concerns only the Tourist Lodge.

Shri G. Mylliemngap (e) :- May we know why there is so much difference between the income during 1974-75?

Shri D.D. Pugh (Minister, Tourism) :- Due to price like in P.O.L. we have to raise the rate from 80 per km to Rs.1.80 per km as a result of which fewer people made the booking.

Shri F.K. Mawlot (c) :- May we know how much Government has benefited from the Tourist Lodge in 1975?

Mr. Speaker :- It is there in (d).

Nursery Schools in Jaintia Hills.

Shri L. Bareh asked :

111. Will the Minister in charge of Education be pleased to state -

(a)

The number of nursery schools so far opened and started in Jaintia Hills District with their locations?

(b)

The number of teachers in each such school?

(c)

Scale of pay of the teachers serving in these schools?

(d)

The managing authority of the above schools?

Shri P.G. Marbaniang (Minister of State in charge of Education) replied :

111.(a)

- 25 (Twenty-five). A statement giving the names, locations, etc of those schools is placed on the Table of the House.

(b)

- 33 (thirty three)

(c)

- No fixed scale exists. Pay varies from one school to another.

(d)

- There is a Managing Committee for each school approved by Deputy Inspector of Schools.

        Just a little correction to 111.(b) The total number of teachers in the 25 nursery Schools in the statement laid on the Table of the House, some schools have one teachers and some schools have 2 teachers.

D.A./T.A. of Police personnel for election duty

Shri R. Mawsor asked :

112. Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state - 

(a)

Whether payment of D.A./T/A. to the Police personnel who have deputed for election duty for Mawthengkut Bye-election in 1973 has since been made?

(b)

If not, when will the payment be made?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

112.(a)

- Yes.

(b)

- Does not arise.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :- 112(c) May we know how many of these police personnel were deputed for election duties in 1973 and whether they have been paid?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- That is a new question.

Shri W. Syiemiong :- When was payment made? That is my question.

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I do not know the exact date, and I require notice for that, Sir.

Shri Francis K. Mawlot :- May I put my question in this way? How many of the police personnel have received payment?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Everybody was paid but I do not know the exact date.

Shri H. Hadem :- What is the total amount involved?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I require notice for that, Sir.

Construction of Roads in Garo Hills.

Shri J.C. Marak asked :

113. Will the Minister in charge of P.W.D. be pleased to state -

(a)

Whether the Government intends to complete construction of the road from Chockpot to Sibbari this year?

(b)

Whether the Government propose to start road construction from Chockpot to Simsanggiri for the benefit of the people of that area?

(c)

Whether the Government propose to take up construction of the road from Mitaggiri to Sibbari, via Rongrikimagiri?

(d)

If so, when?

Shri P.R. Kyndiah (Minister P.W.D.) replied :

113.(a)

- Detailed estimate is under preparation.

(b)

- Yes.

(c) & (d)

- Yes. It is provided in the Border Areas Development Scheme for Annual Plan, 1976-77.


Calling Attention

Mr. Speaker :- Let us pass on to Item No.2. Mr. Hadem and Mr. G. Mylliemngap to call the attention of the Chief Minister under Rule 54 of the Rules of Procedure of Business in the House.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to call the attention of the Chief Minister under Rule 54 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly to a news item published in the "Implanter" under the caption. From Khasi to Mikir Hills". In this connection I beg to State that we are grateful to the Government for informing the House on the agreement between the two Chief Minister and the clarification on the boundary dispute between this State and the State of Assam. Sir, in the statement issued by the "Implanter" under the said caption. "From Khasi to Mikir Hills" it was stated that within............

Mr. Speaker :- The Chief Minister has read out, but if you have anything more to say besides the news item in the "Implanter", then you my state it.

Shri H. Hadem :- Sir, this is the very first step and the matter is being taken up and it appears, Sir, that other boundary disputes have started in Khasi Hills and also in Jaintia Hills and Garo Hills as well. As such, Sir we are very eager to know if after the final agreement has been made, whether any alteration can be made. Also whether any agreement has been arrived at between the two Chief Ministers. I have nothing much to add, but as Stated in this news item the people are very much worried and as such we would like to know the position.

Mr. Speaker :- Mr. Mylliemngap.

*Shri G. Mylliemngap :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to call the attention of the Chief Minister under Rule 54 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly to a news item published in "U Pietngor" or the 25th March 1976 under the caption "Ka Pynbeit pud Khasi bad ka Mikir Hills". Mr. Speaker, Sir, my brief statement in this particular publication is that we are really grateful of the two Hon'ble Chief Ministers of Assam and Meghalaya who have taken the initiative to re-examine this case. Here, Sir, it is stated in "U Pietngor" and I just want to make a statement that according to the report of the D.C. Mr. Maxwell, the then Deputy Commissioner of Khasi and Jaintia Hills in 1980, which says in a document that the three villages viz., Sabuda, Jatalong and Umwang fall under the administration of the Khyrim Syiemship. The document reads like this : "From the conjunction of .............. and............ rivers the boundary runs in a north easterly direction in a straight line to a pillar about seven hundred yards eastwards of the boundary site of the village just near the village then straight in a north westerly direction to junction or............ and up the river to its junction in Umjaknieh stream then up the............. to its source a pillar is erected under the .............. then downopposite side, of the plateau along the stream known as um.............. Here Mr. Speaker, Sir, my submission is that there is a little confusion  because mention has been made twice about the Umjaknieh. This river rises from the east where at present these is forest beat house of the Mikir Hills and that river flows and follow a U course and where it meets the river Umkhen which is actually a portion falling under the Khyrim Syiemship, for normal administration. From Umkhen this boundary goes upstream to Umthadring where there is a small plateau and in that plateau that is present a Church-the Church of God and the pillar is just near the church. From there it goes upto the source of the river Umjaknieh and goes up the plateau to the villages of Radha and.............. these two villages are well inside the Khyrim Syiemship. Mr. Speaker, Sir, and from that plateau it goes sought of the plateau and it goes down, up to the river Umjaknieh. Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is my little submission. I feel that if the statement as published is correct, that these three villages cannot be claimed as a whole that they are within the territory of Meghalaya, then only a portion right from the river Umwai inhabited by the Khasis, is very much within the administrative control of the Syiem of Khyrim and it must be within Meghalaya.

Mr. Speaker :- Since you have read from the document you have to place it on the Table of the House. You may please lay it now. Will the Chief Minister now reply?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am indeed grateful to both the hon. Members for giving me this opportunity to clarify to the House about this matter in the calling attention notice. I am indeed very grateful to Mr. Mylliemngap who has been pleased to read out this document in the floor of the House. Mr. Speaker, Sir, as the House is aware, the Government of Meghalaya have been taking active steps in order to remove the misunderstanding in respect of certain areas on the Assam-Meghalaya border. On the 29th February 1976, a meeting was held at the level of Chief Ministers of both the States in Dispur where it was appreciated that there has been some misunderstandings and, in some cases, differences with respect to boundary lines on account of missing or absence of boundary pillars or clear ground marks and that while the notifications are there, it will be necessary to have ground clarification to remove the differences. It was also decided that officers of the concerned departments of the two Government should meet and pinpoint the areas that need clarification so that it can be taken up first at the officers' level and then the Minister's level. it was also agreed that Deputy Commissioners and Superintendent of Police of the concerned Districts should meet at least once a month of disc use matters effecting the people living in the border of the Districts. The role of the Deputy Commissioners and Superintendents of Police was thus confined only to routine matters of maintaining law and order in the border areas, easing of tension, etc. Decisions on substantive issues relating to the actual alignment of the border can, of course, be taken only at the level of the State Government and the question of interpretation of the various notifications is a technical matter that has to be settled on the basis of joint demarcation by the survey parties of both the State who are to submit reports of the State Governments concerned. No statement made at the level of Deputy Commissioners regarding the actual alignment of boundary in areas where there is difference of opinion can therefore be binding on the Governments, as these are technical matters of which Government decisions would be taken only after receipt of reports from survey authorities. The Government of Assam has been informed by this Government of this position. This has also been clarified by our officers at the meeting held on 12th March, 1976 among the representatives of the two State Governments that Sabuda, Jatalang and Umwang area were not specifically mentioned it the 1951 notification and that it needed ground clarification and that it is a case of joint survey.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, may I seek one clarification? May we understand which meetings is to be taken as authentic. Whether the meeting of the officers or that of the Commissioners?

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The authority is that of the Government. They are simply to pinpoint the areas where there is dispute and difference of opinion.

Mr. Speaker :- In other words, these three villages have been located as one of the areas of the State by the Government of Assam. The Government of Meghalaya has pin-pointed that this is the area of dispute.

Shri G. Mylliemngap :- According to the information published in the paper, it is stated that the Government of Meghalaya has agreed that these three villages were in Mikir Hills.

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- It is not a fact, Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Mr. Speaker :- Let us pass on to Item No.3. The Finance Minister to present the Supplementary Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General of India for the year 1973-74 Government of Meghalaya.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to present the Supplementary Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General of India for the year 1973-74 - Government of Meghalaya.


Government Bills

Mr. Speaker :- Item No.4. The Minister incharge of Finance to move that the House agrees that leave be granted to withdraw the Meghalaya Purchase Tax (Amendment) Bill, 1976, which was introduced on the 20th March, 1976.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that leave be granted to withdraw the Meghalaya Purchase Tax (Amendment) Bill, 1976.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. I put the question before the House. The question is that leave be granted to withdraw the Meghalaya Purchase Tax (Amendment) Bill, 1976, which was introduced on the 20th March, 1976.

(The motion was carried and leave was granted).

        The Meghalaya Purchase Tax (Amendment) Bill, 1976, stands withdraw. Item No.5. The Chief Minister to move that the Meghalaya Prevention of Gambling (Amendment) Bill, 1976 be taken into consideration.

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, (I beg to move that the Meghalaya Prevention of Gambling (Amendment Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Prevention of Grambling (Amendment) Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

(The motion was carried)

        Now since there is no amendment, may I ask the Chief Minister to move that the Bill be passed.

Shri W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir I went to move that the Meghalaya Prevention of Gambling (Amendment) Bill, 1976 be passed.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved I put the question before the House : The question is that the Meghalaya Prevention of Gambling (Amendment) Bill, 1976 be passed.

(The Motion was carried, and the bill was passed.)

        Item No.6. Now, the Minister in charge of Finance to move that the Meghalaya Finance Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Meghalaya Finance Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Finance Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

(The motion was carried)

        Now, since I have received no amendment of the Bill, may I ask the Finance Minister to move that the Bill be passed?

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Meghalaya Finance Bill, 1976, be passed.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Finance Bill, 1976, be passed.

(The motion was carried and the Bill was passed)

        Item No.7, Minister, Finance to move.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Meghalaya Chit Fund and Money Circulation Scheme (Prohibition) Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. Now I put the question the House. The question is that the Bill be taken into consideration.

(The Motion was carried by voice vote)

        Since I have received no amendment to the Bill may I ask the Minister to move that the Bill be passed.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Bill be passed.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. Now I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Chit Fund and Money Circulation Scheme (Prohibition) Bill, 1976, be passed.

(The motion was carried by voice and the bill was passed)

        Item No.8 Minister, Finance to move

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Meghalaya Credit Operation and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill, 1976, be taken into consideration.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. Now I put the question before the House. The question is that the Bill be taken into consideration.

(The motion was carried)

        Since there is no amendment to the Bill, I will ask the Minister to move that the Bill be passed.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Bill be passed.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved. Now I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Credit Operation and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill, 1976, be passed.

(The motion was carried by voice vote and the bill passed) 


Motions

        Let us pass on to item No.9 - Motions. Now Motion No.1 standing in the name of Mr. H.E. Pohshna seems to concern with the matter which has already been discussed during the current Session on more than one occasion and only this morning also during the question hour supplementaries have been asked regarding the policy of the Government so far as distilleries are concerned. I do not know whether the hon. Member has anything more than what he has already raised. Do you have something mere?

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that this House do not discuss the shifting of the Jowai Distillery form Umhyngiar.

Mr. Speaker :- Motion moved.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Sir, in this connection, since much had been discussed, I would like only to raise certain points. Sir, a reply was made this morning by the Minister in charge, Excise, that the matter is under consideration. But according to the budget provision of this year and also of last year there had been details in the budget. For the year 1976-77, there is an item under the head of account-239 and there is the shifting of Jowai distillery from Umshyngiar Rs.40,000/- Moreover, Sir, I take it that when the budget prevision is already there, the Government have come to a decision otherwise, how can they make a budget provision for this very head. On the other hand, in reply to a question as to whether it is a fact that the then Excise Minister had given an assurance on the shifting the reply was that the former Excise Minister had only discussed the matter in the meeting. But in the representation of the people of Jowai town it has been mentioned : "Lastly, there was assurance from the former Minister in charge, Excise, Shri B.B. Lyngdoh, in a meeting of public leaders at the District Council Hall at Jowai that the distillery at Umshyngiar it to be shifted to a secluded place as the town is growing rapidly with the march of time, progress, development," and "a site was selected". This representation was signed by leaders like the Chairman-Shilliang-Raj, Chairman-Lions Cub, General Secretary-Lions Club and also by the Secretaries and Chairman of the different clubs of the different localities of Jowai town. Of course, I do not challenge that they meetings after meetings were held where the local leaders, MLAs, etc. attended and they were of the opinion that it should be shifted. On the other hand, the population is increasing and the town is in need of expansion and so the present site of this distillery is now very close to the Khimmusnign school and the Shilliang Raj Lower Primary School. Therefore, the people sent this representation not with the intension of bringing prohibition but only in the interest of the people, the young boys of the locality. Moreover, it has been stated in the letter of the Sub-divisional Officer in 1964 that : "A decision was taken for shifting of the Distillery at Jowai to another site" and also in the letter No.KJEX/J/10/62-63/82 dated 15th October, 1962, addressed to the Commissioner of Excise, regarding immediate shifting. "I have the honour to State that the public of the Jowai Sub-division are praying hard for its immediate shifting to a corner of the town. I would there request you to kindly obtain Government decision on the subject at an early date."

        Sir, I would not take long as I am going to resume my seat. But the entire town of Jowai with the possible exception of a few, are of the opinion that this should be shifted. So, Sir, whether the Government should consider the wish of the people in general or they are considered the wish of some. During the question hour a point was raised as to whether compensation would be involved. Yes, it will be involved but I don't think that compensation will exceed two will be involved but I don't think that compensation will exceed two sales of this liquor shop - (At this stage, the Speaker, left the Chamber and the Deputy Speaker occupied the Chair) and I think it will cover. So I will request in the general interest of the public that the Government take serious action in this matter and the representation of the people be considered favourable by the Government.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, just one clarification. The hon. Member has just now referred to a meeting held at the District Council Halt which the previous Excise Minister also attended. I would like to know as to what was the date.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Thank you, but I was not present in that meeting. But this representation was signed by all the public leaders including the Secretaries and Chairmen of different localities and clubs.

Shri H. Hadem :- I am not interested to know whether he was present or not. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir. We want to know the date. If he does not know the date, then, at least the year in which that meeting was held.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- It has not been mentioned but mention is made about a meeting in the District Council Hall.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also want to take part in this particular Motion. The hon. Member had mentioned specifically about the meeting held in the District Council Hall with the then Excise Minister. Sir, I want to know the date because it so happened that I was also one of the persons present there in that particular meeting. I wonder if what the hon. Member said happened in that meetings because there was no discussion about the matter in that particular meeting. As I remember, the question about the foreign liquor shop which is so close and near the bazar and other matters were discussed in the meetings and, if my memory does not fail me I did not remember that the time regarding the distillery at Umshyngiar had been discussed in that meetings. Anyway, there may be some other meetings since the hon. Member did not mention the specific date of the meeting but Sir, at the same time also I would like to refer to this Motion moved by the hon. Member that during the discussion, the hon. Member had also had the occasion of referring and meeting some of the official leaders from the head of the District of the other superior officers to whom communication has been made. I don't think Sir, whether this is correct or not and if this is not the procedure within the code already made by the Government, then I hope that this will not be a very very specific precedent in so far as it appears.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, just on a point of clarification. These are copies attached with the same representation.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if this is so I do not know how copies are taken attached, and I do not know whether they are certified copied or not but according to me. Sir, this is very very irregular. I took this as a part of  official secretly. So, Sir, I did not agree with the hon. Member who moved the Motion.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- There are the copies of letters sent to the parties to represent.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it would have been very proper had the hon. member at the time he presented his case made all the clarification rather than making obstructions during the discussion. (Interruption). Any how, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, since he has said like that. I will take it to be so and probably if that is correct, and in the proper form then it is up to the Government to say. But, Sir, we have been facing from year to year with the difficult financial position and every year we have seen that a deficit Budget is presented. And the present case of shifting the Umshyngiar Distillery to another place has already been replied by the Minister in charge of Excise Sir, it seem that it will involve heavy financial expenditure. Moreover, Sir, the hon. Member got the impression always of struggling and fighting for the implementation of the first steps towards prohibition and so I do not understand why at this stage, he would bring such a Motion for at least, shifting this Distillery to another place which would not only involved the Exchequer of the State but at the same time, involve the non-implementation of this scheme which he already mentioned in the previous discussion (laughter).

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, "Sir, when the hon. Member said the "first steps towards prohibition" ........................ (Interruption).

Shri H. Hadem :- Sir, it will be very very correct and very very specific if the hon. Member rather brings the Motion calling for the House to discuss about the prohibition and the doing away with the Distillery, now at present at Umshyngiar but instead, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, by implication., it means that he wants improvement of the existing Distillery by shifting it to another place. So according to me Sir, I think that in view of the many schemes and programmes that this State is embarking upon at present in which we, as Members of the house had discussed about the roads, the bridges' the dispensaries and others which are very very important. I do not think Sir, that at present this matter should  be taken up on a priority basis. As a matter of fact, I do not think if to be very very necessary at the present stage. As such Sir, I am very strongly against the motion.

Shri Maham Singh :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I also support the motion of the hon. Member from Nongtalang that the Distillery at Umshyngiar should be shifted immediately. As a matter of fact, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I consider that the Government should not have waited for a public demand in this matter. The Government of its own initiative should have taken steps to shift the Distillery from Umshyngiar to another place and away from the present place, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, because at present, this Distillery is situated in the heart of the town and it is not desirable to have a Distillery in the heart of the town.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Sorry to interrupt Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not think the hon. Member has seen the place. The Distillery is not situated in the heart of the town.

Shri Maham Singh :- It may be just in the suburb of the town. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the distillery of Shillong was started more than 50 years ago when this town was just a little hamlet but even then the Distillery at that time was located more than 4 miles away from Shillong. There is no reason why this Distillery should not be shifted away from this place especially when the public demanded that it should be shifted and in view of the fact that there is already a provision in the Budget for the shifting of the Distillery from this very place. Now, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think it is not very material to consider the question of expenditure being involved. Our friend from Mynso said that quite a huge amount of expenditure will be involved if this Distillery is shifted from the Umshyngiar area but, I would submit that it will not be such a huge expenditure. The owners of the land where the present Distillery is located, have never taken compensation for the location of the Distillery in their own land. what they demanded is that the Distillery should be shifted away from their place as they opposed the setting up or establishment of the Distillery in their land. Mr. Deputy Speaker, and then again, the ultimate aim of every State is total prohibition. That is the ultimate aim for the good of the future generation. Many of the States have declared many areas of their States as dry areas in spite of the fact that they have to lose a considerable amount of revenue which they were getting from distilleries. Therefore, Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, there is no reason whatsoever way we should not shift the distillery from Umshyngiar to some other place in spite of the expenditure involved in this shifting. With these few words I support this Motion that this distillery should be shifted from Umshyngiar to any other place further from the town.

Shri B.B. Lyngdoh (Minister, Finance ) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, before the Minister in charge would reply to this Motion, I would like to inform the House that I was present in that meeting which was referred to by the hon. Member from Nongtalang. I would like to  say a few words that about 2 years ago, in fact every now and then, whenever I visited Jowai town, I used to have discussion at various levels, with the District Council, with officers of the Government, with the local leaders including the leaders from that area on various matters. About 2 years ago I had the opportunity to attend a meeting in which the leaders of the town as well as a few leaders from the rural areas were also present. The meeting was held in the District Council Hall and the discussion took place on various matters viz, improvement of Jowai Town, growth of the town, need for widening the town and the question of congestion in the Bazar areas and so on. In that meeting the officer from P.W.D. and other Departments were also present. In ter alia, the question of distillery at Umshyngiar was discussed. Some were of the opinion that it should be shifted to some distance place whereas some others were of the opinion that there was no scope for expanstion of the town that side and as such shifting of the distillery was not necessary. So the matter was discussed this way and that way. In fact, the Department considered the proposal for shifting this distillery to some other place As a matter of fact some areas were being investigated for the purpose of shifting after a decision was taken. There is also a budget provision in case the Government decides to shift.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in order to make it clear to everybody, I would like to tell a story about the establishment of the Umshyngiar Distillery. It was in the year 1947 before independence that I was very much in the know of the things since I was working in the S.D.O's office. Before the distillery was set up at Umshyngiar the S.D.O. called upon the leader of Jowai town as well as the Doloi of Jowai and it was they who selected this area. Because it was thought that there was no scope whatsoever for expansion of the town. But after the distillery was set up in the area, those people started claiming rights over the land where the distillery was located. But that was prior to Independence, and as you know, at that time all lands within the upland areas of Jaintia Hills belonged to the Government. The leaders of the Town and administrative head of the Elaka had already handed over the lands of the Government for establishment of the distillery. There is no point in claiming right or title over the lands once the lands were handed over to the Government and the distillery was set up. Therefore, we cannot entertain and claim whatsoever that the lands were the distillery is situated now belong to anybody. The land belongs to Government only. The hon. Mover of the Motion has mentioned about the assurance given by the Minister in that meeting. But the whole Executive Committee members of the District Council who were present in the meeting were deadly against the idea shifting of this distillery. The hon. Mover has referred to the representation filed by the public of Jowai to the Chief Minister, and for this there was a signature campaign. But that signature campaign was for some other purpose. Here with me I have got another representation from the public of Jowai opposing the shifting of the distillery. Therefore, we have asked the D.C. Jowai to have a thorough enquiry on the representation. So speaking on this particular subject of shifting of the distillery, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to say that we are trying to implement the 12-Point Programme and now at this juncture if we start shifting this distillery to some other places, then it would cast a bad reflection on us that we are so much interested in promoting liquor consumption instead of taming this trend. What is the use of awakening up this sleeping giant? 

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, on a point of information, I am very grateful to the Minister when he said that the giant would wake up, then why don't you close it down?

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we don't mind to close it down. But it will take time, and once we close it down it may have some reaction, but anyhow our Policy is to slow down or reduce the productive. Now in view of our policy we are not increasing licences any more and even we have declared in our press statement also that we will see that it is not extended any more or that we should not give any more new licence. About the remark made by one hon. Member that this distillery area is right in the heart of the town, it is not correct. People who are going or who have been to Jowai especially the hon. Member from Mawlai, I believe know the place better than any body. The hon. Member from Mawlai has also certified that the distillery area at Jowai is outside the town of Jowai and even the M.L.A. from Mawkyrwat area is also knows the area very well (laughter)

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, he may know.............

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in this connection Shilliangraj and Khimmusniang localities are already there long before the distillery was established there. So the question of extending the town to that area does not arise because beyond the selected area there is no more scope for any more expansion. They are more or less secretive areas. Therefore, as far as this distillery area is concerned, this area is the best area for a distillery because all the dirt from that area will flow down to the river Myntdu and will not go down to Jowai even we wish it. Therefore, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as the hon. Members who have spoken in favour of the Motion said that it is the wish of the people to shift the distillery but I definitely know that this distillery was established there by the wish of the people. It was already established before Independence of India and I was at that time in the know of things as I have already mentioned. The S.D.O. called all the leaders of Jowai Town including the Dolois and it was they who selected this area.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think there should be a referendum.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if the hon. Member wants to have referendum and if he bears all the expenditure we don't mind to accept that challenge. We don't mind to have that referendum, if he is really to bear all the expenses for that purpose.

Shri H. Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, let the hon. Member bring forward another motion for the referendum.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, in charge Excise) :- Yes, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- Yes, with the cooperation of the hon. Member from Mynso.

Shri H. Hadem :- I think we shall cooperate.

Shri E. Bareh (Minister, Excise) :- Therefore, at the moment Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Government is not considering the shifting of the Distillery from Umshyngiar. So with these few words. I think the matter may be closed now.

Shri H.E. Pohshna :- I thank the Minister when he said that the representation is under consideration of the Government.

Mr. Deputy Speaker :- Motion No.1 is closed and now let us come to motion No.2 by Shri S.D. Khongwir.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that this House do now discuss the need to create business opportunity and incentives to all the local tribals.

Mr. Deputy Speaker :- Motion moved. Now you can discuss.

Shri S.D. Khongwir :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not have much to say in this Motion although I consider it to be very important for the interest of the local tribals in so far as business is concerned Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, it may appear this Motion is a little bit awkward and so it may embarrass certain persons on a section of the society who are not covered by the wordings of this Motion because here Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would to confine only to the creation of business opportunities and incentives to the local tribals. That is why Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I say that certain sections of the society may feel a little bit embarrassed Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not mean any harm or for the matter to cause any embarrassment to any section of the  society, but my only intention in bringing this Motion is to discuss about our own problems my problems and the problem of the tribal people of our State. So Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I may be charged for this Motion as being liberal or narrow-minded or parochial, but actually Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have no such intention as such intention as I said earlier. My sole intention to discuss this Motion is that I am confident that we have got every right to discuss end I have a right to discuss about myself and that is why I have brought this motion here. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, while speaking about our State, we from our side and from the Treasury bench's side also use to call this State of ours as being an infant State, a young State and I know that it is indeed a very young State. Why? because it is hardly 4 or 5 years only that we have got our State, we have achieved the Statehood and so Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to remind all of us here that the creation of this beautiful State was not invidious, it was not a gift by somebody or some persons although Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, during the time when we were struggling for this State we have received the good-will, the support of all sections of the people here in India. I remember if I am not mistaken the words of the Prime Minster, Smti Indira Gandhi, when she said on the floor of Parliament one day the "Meghalaya is receiving the support of all the sections of the House" that means the Parliament itself. This means the country as a whole has given us support and the whole country understood that we the Hills people need that and that it is for their benefit. So Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, there have been some persons who would like to own or to claim the credit yet I would like to mention no names here and and it may be Mr. A. or B. like that I would like to say that it is me who has brought this State to you the people of Meghalaya, but Mr. Deputy Speaker, this is not true. It has been the united endeavour, the united efforts of all the hill people of our State and that has been the long cherished desire of the hill people for almost two decades now. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we have been struggling to get this State for a long time. So I would like to make this declaration or this announcement in this very august House that not a single individual or any person should entertain this sort of idea and the State was achieved because of only one or two persons which is basically incorrect. Now Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, after we have achieved this State, it is not our duty to see that we maintain the State and the maintenance of this beautiful State should be according to our own genius. It has ready been said, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that we the hill people, through our tribal genius have been able to acquire this State and now this tribal genius we should try to maintain our State. The most important thing is the maintenance of our State is the population character of the State. Sir, I had the occasion earlier in the House to discuss about this matter and in a democratic system, of Government, this is the most important thing. So Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, while speaking about this population character of our State, I would as an example, like to bring out one aspect of this population character. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, during the last few months I have been able to visit certain areas in my constituency and other areas also and Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, with due respect to this section fo the society, I would like to mention it by name and I think that there is no harm to mention it by name that our brothers and sisters from Nepal have come to our State in a large number. When I visited these places, I was shocked to see them in such a large number  and there they have established their khuties and houses. But Sir, when I visited those areas five or six years ago, I would no notice that there were these khuties and houses at that time. But now, Mr. Deputy Speaker,  Sir, I am astonished to see that these places have been crowded with so many khuties and houses. While saying so, I do not mean any offence to Nepali friends who have been already here in our State of Meghalaya for generations together or those who are here for the last 25 or 50 years. Sir, even in my area there are so many of my Nepali friends and they have come to my house whenever such necessities arise and I know these persons who are here in our State for the last so many years and they are part and parcel of our State. But Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have also noticed that it is not only in Khasi Hills; it is not only in Jaintia Hills but it is also in Garo Hills that their population is larger. Sir, the Hon'ble Chief Minister had once the occasion to reply to this august House when certain clarification was sought for in connection with the electoral roll for non-inclusion of hundreds and thousands of Nepalis in the electoral. I clearly remember the very wordings of the Chief Minister when he replied to a question raised by the hon. Member from Cantonment area. He said that it is very difficult on the part of the Government to know the persons who have come from Nepal and it is also very difficult to differentiate a person whether he has come only yesterday or whether he is here for the last so many years and by virtue of their coming Meghalaya it does not mean that these persons have already acquired Indian Citizenship. And it is infact, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, according to my own experience, when I have seen for the last few months so many new face whom I never saw before. Sir, these people have come to our State and have established their khuties and houses and so on and so forth. So, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in this way we have been exploited by the people from outside the State.

        Well Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would expect the Government to realise this very important aspect of the State building and as I have said earlier that it is the people who build the State. Now the present population structure of Meghalaya is hardly 80 to 81 percent of tribal population whereas about ten years ago, it was about 87 or 88 percent. So this percentage of tribal population ahs gone down from 87 to 81 per cent and this is more according to 1971 census and I am sure Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that this 81 per cent of tribal population is not the correct figure. Sir, I don't think that the census operation has taken note of those persons who are in the interior and who are not tribals. So, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir,  from a closer glance of the three Districts of our State, in so far as the other communities are concerned, I think the correct ratio between tribals and non-tribals would be of the order of 75 to 85 percent. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I stand for correction of my discussion about this motion. I would say Sir, that it is a fact that there are employment and business avenues in our State which have encouraged the people from outside the State to come to this beautiful State of ours. And Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, they have every right to come when we ourselves do not enter into these business. When we ourselves do not take interest in it, naturally other people from outside the State will come to Meghalaya and I think that they have every right to come to this State of Meghalaya. If they do not take this opportunity then they are simply fools. Sir, now it is for us to consider what steps should be taken to try to stops the outsiders to come to our State. In so far as employment is concerned Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the Government have got to evolve their own policy and I think with the exception of one or two instances where specifically in regard to the technical persons we have heard a lot about the recruitment of technical persons. We realise the difficulties faced by the Government. It  is difficult to get technical person to man all the technical posts in the State, e.g. in the P.H.E and in the P.W.D. department. There are a lot of difficulties faced by the Government in getting our own people to man these technical posts. But the main channel or the conduct of all the people from outside the State is in the field of business.

        Now Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to point out with due respect to my own community and the tribal people as a whole I have noticed that our tribals are not business-minded, but it is now for us. It is not only up to the Government but it is also up to all of us the responsible Member of the community to try and educate our own people to go in for business, because Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if we ourselves do not go for business in the State, naturally it will leave ample room for the outsiders to come and do business in  our State. The other day Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, the hon. Member from Kherapara and the occasion to discuss about benami transactions in so far as the P.W.D. is concerned. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, benami transaction is not confined only to Garo Hills, but it happens here also in Khasi Hills and in Jaintia Hills also. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in this so called benami transaction, the Hon'ble Minister P.W.D. the other day had said that this benami transaction should be rooted out from the State. When I was at Tura, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I had the occasion to meet one of the Executive Members of the Garo Hills District Council and  and had some discussion with regard to the number of non-tribals manning the different shops in Tura areas and I was told by the Executive Member that the District Council had constructed several shops just near the bazar area itself with the purpose that these shops should be given to the local people. It is a fact that most probably the names of these shops are in the names of Momin, Marak, Sangma, but in actual practice these shops have been run by Mr. Agarwal, Das, Chakraborty.................

(Voices ......... Joshi) (Laughter)

        Joshi, Upadhya and others. So Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I again stand corrected. In my opinion these benami transactions, I take them to be an act of exploitation against the tribal people. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, this benami transaction, I take it to be an act of exploitation against the tribal people and Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have been once to Imphal and I was impressed by the Manipuri people  at Imphal. I was really astonished to see that most of the shops were being run by the local people themselves with the exception of one or two shops here and there, but the majority of the business at Imphal itself are being run by the local people. So, Deputy Speaker, Sir, as I have already said that we the tribal people are not business minded; now it is up to us and the Government to try to educate our people, let us teach them to the extent that even when we throw him to the river he will try to swim. Let us train our people educate our people to that extent that most of us would become business minded and try to run our own business here in our State so that there will be no room for outsiders to come and do business here in our State. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as I have said earlier, I do not have much to discuss on this motion. I would like now to give a few suggestions only to the Government. So these suggestions which I have listed I will simply read for the consumption of the Government and for the consideration and also at the same time. No. I Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like the Government to discourage very vehemently this, what we called the benami transaction and as I have said earlier, let us try to educate our people at the Government level, at our level, at the village level and at all levels about the evils of this benami transaction. No.2 Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, very shortly, the Government will establish headquarters at the new Districts and the new sub-division, care should be taken to see that at these centres, we should see that in the fields of business, special care should be taken to encourage our people through the opening as the Government had already said, of trade centres, let us open trade centres in advance so that our people can get facilities to enter into business, but at the same time, we must also meet these people take them to see for themselves and get them to try to do business. No.3 Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, is with regard to the preferential treatment being given to genuine tribal firms. This has been done since the time of the Government of Assam and there is seven and half percent preferential treatment given to the genuine tribal firms, but in this respect, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have noticed that some officer are following this preferential treatment of these are being given to the tribal firms. In some offices, this has not been followed. So it is not uniformed in so far as the different offices of the State Government are concerned. Now Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in so far as this aspect of the matter is concerned, I would like to suggest to the Government that the seven and half percent should at least be raised to twelve and half percent. The preferential treatment may be raised from seven and half to twelve and half percent at least for ten years so that our people will get more chance of entering into business an this will be one of the incentives that can be offered by the Government. Until that time, after ten years, when we stand on a more firmer ground, then it can be treated at par with other businessman and traders also.

        (4) Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, Government should try to encourage our people to take to small business like barber, cobbler, umbrella-making and so on and so forth. Short-course training can be arranged for these trades and in this aspect, I would like to appeal to the Government and to us also. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, sometimes it becomes very difficult for us, I do not know about the people of Jaintia or Garo Hills, but for the Khasi sometimes he feels that this work is not for him to become a cobbler or a barber or umbrella makers. Sometimes we consider that it is not fit for us to do these works below our dignity, e.g. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in this case of recruitment to Police, I remember about 5 to 10 years ago, if you ask a Khasi young man to join the Police Force he will definitely say that he will not joint this post because it is below his dignity because in Khasi language we use to call the Police as 'Pulit dap ram' which means indebted  Police man. Because of this low pay,  he has to take loan from so many people. But now, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we see that so many of our Garo, Khasi and Jaintia friends have come forward to join the Police Force. So also in these small trade or business like barber cobbler or umbrella making, etc., a time will come when we will have to take up these small business. We cannot depend only on the employment potentials from the Government. Formerly about 10 years ago, if your enquire a peon an officer or somebody from the office would have to request somebody to take up this job. It was as bad as that 10 year ago. But now even for one post of peon, the candidates will be about 400 to 500.

        (5) Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in the Government offices, we have got, I think, several purchase Boards and the present situation of these Purchase boards is that all of them are official members. Here is an instance where the Government - Government I mean at the ministerial level, they do not have any say on the action of the Purchase Boards where only the officers in the offices in so far as purchase of stores etc. is concerned and with due respect of the bureaucrats, I do not know how much they understand the things that we feel as a community for the interest of a tribal people especially. I do not know how our bureaucrats understand this feeling that we have. So Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would suggest that if possible to give a non-official ling to these Purchase Boards.

        (6) Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I do not know whether it is relevant on irrelevant - here the word marriages decovenant or marriages with tribal families and for business methods should be considered as an act of exploitation and should be considered as an  act of exploitation and should not be encouraged. I have known so many instances, Sir, especially one case at Nongpoh that happened with the District Council. The District Council. about a couple of months ago, sent one Inspector of Trades to one shop and he demanded a trade licence from a non-tribal there, and he was asked to

Shri D.D. Lapang :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to associate myself with the discussion on the motion moved by the hon. Member from the other side. In my opinion what the hon. member lays is true and I fall in line with the suggestions and improvement he has given. Sir, there should be special efforts on the part of the  Government to see that our tribal people will have sufficient scope fo their self-improvement and better facilities and also to see that there is liberty for their survival. The very fundamental meaning of the struggle for a separate State is that we may have the liberty and freedom to survive in all spheres for the people living in this part of country. The word used by the member is "exploitation" and he has hoped that by attaining our own State we will not be faced with the same situation which was prevailing while we were in Assam. Now it is not a fact to be denied that even in the present State of ours this exploitation is still there, not that Government encourages it but because our people are still lagging behind. They cannot compete with other people coming from outside in trade. Our people are not having the experience and these is lace of interest also. It is expected that by having our own State does not mean to provide "white-coloured jobs" to our people but to see that our people can survive in all parts of the State and in every walk of life. Which means that a cultivators will cultivate like a real farmer and a business man will be a business man in the real sense of term. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I say that it is very high time on the part of the Government to see that our tribal people in Meghalaya should be well looked after. I am not referring to those people who come from outside but I am referring to all who are living in Meghalaya. So we should make special efforts for our people and this is not objectionable and it is an accepted fact which is also endorsed by the Central Government by giving our tribal people special treatment like scholarships and employment. Thus we are getting special treatment and we should also give special treatment to our people. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, now we appreciate that our Government has come up with a scheme for giving specialised training for our people. Mr. Deputy Speaker, now we appreciate that our Government has come up with a scheme for giving specialised training for our people in different categories of our people. For instance carpentry, printing and also weaving and we are already gratified to Government for that. But what is the fate of these trainees after back of the soil. There are many cases like tailors also. After completion of training they go back to the soil and there is no scope for them. So I would suggest that Government after completion of their training should give them grant not only money but also in kind like sewing machines and other raw materials. Government should also have a follow up policy to see that the money given is properly utilised and not spent uselessly. So by taking effective measures we can help our people and they don't have to go back to the soil. Of course we need cultivators, but if Government wants to see that they survive in their trade in which they  are trained and they are well skilled they should be supplied with raw materials and other help. In this way people will take up the profession for which they are trained. 

        Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, now regarding finance. This is one of the main troubles of our people. They could not complete with people from outside the State so far as financial matters are concerned. For instance you will observe a lot of our tribal people there. But the moment you construct a cement building our people will be nowhere because  the people from outside will come to the owner and say: I will give you advance for one year or three years and even for constructing new buildings. But our people cannot come forward like this due to their bad economic situation. They manage their own shops with an amount of Rs.50 or Rs.100. So how can they advance Rs.5,000 or Rs.20,000. This is the affairs of the day. So I request that our Government will please look into this.

        Also you will find that they are not helping our people much. They are opening branches here and there so that they can come up. With the slogan to the Prime Minister that they are helping the people in the interior, but they are in fact not serving the people, I have seen these branches in Nongpoh and Umsning and it is really horrible. The people have to mortgage this and that. Also there should be guarantors and many other formalities which make it very inconvenient to these rural people. They want this thing and that thing and as very well stated by the hon. Member if you do not start a shop you cannot expect to get money. And for starting a shop experienced is necessary. Even for opening a small shop you need money and experience should be there. So in this way these banks are not really serving the people even though they have branches . Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we have seen that this Bank has got its branch only about 10 kilometers from Shillong and some of the branches have to serve within a radius of 10 kilometers, As such, we have seen also that only those shops which are very close to the bank's building could get some financial assistance. But what about the interior places where there are villages situated many many miles deep inside. In the whole of their existence these poor villages in the interior never get any financial help nor any facility extended to them by those banks as they never exist in the interior except near motorable roads. So Sir, I would request the Government to see that those banks really serve our people and that these formalities and procedure will not be strict so that the people are entitled to get loans and some sort of financial assistance. It is very much appreciable that the Government now has decided to open some trade centres and also, I understand that they are going to open one market place at Polo Ground shortly. In this connection I would like to make one suggestion that we must see that the same story will not be repeated here if there is trade centre, our people will be entitled to enter in that trade provided they have got money. In case they do not have money, may I request the Government to see how to provide them with financial that is for those people who have got a scope to enter in that trade. I believe the Government will not leave  them half way. At the same time, we are public leaders and responsible representative have got so much scope to cooperate with the Government to see that deserving people get money from the Government so that they will be able to make a good start. With these few words, I appreciate the hon. Member who has brought forward this very important motion of the welfare of our backward people.

Shri F.K. Mawlot :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, in associating myself with the motion brought forward by my friend from Mawlai, I have but little more points to add. As the mover of the motion has pointed out, our local tribals are not business-minded. Well, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I am sorry I have to mention this here on the floor of the House, but whether our Government have tried to encourage our people to change and to become a little bit business conscious. It all depends on the Government and also to each one of us to encourage the people and more on Government for necessary fund. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, we had the occasion last time to speak on the fund utilised by the Ministers for their tours and so on. We know that the Ministers, the MLAs and the Government officials have toured the State and they have gone to the remotest corner and interior and interior most areas of the State. But in so far as business is concerned, neither the officials nor the ministers have tried to put emphasis on its importance. We have not told the people to do business. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, instead of doing that what we practically see is that ministers go from one place to another, of course, their programmes is official, with certain topics to be discussed. But always, the only topics discussed in such meetings were the affairs of the Party. As the hon. Member from Nongtalang had occasion to mention in this House last time, at the gate it was written 'wel-come' 'The 20-point Economic Programme of the Prime Minister', but inside there is another/red/cloth written in white "APHLC Conference" Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, if we have realised that the economy of our people could not be developed because they have not been able to understand or to put that amount of importance on business, Government should have proposed to discuss this topic whenever Ministers or Government officials go out on tours. This topic should be discussed in the meeting Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, as the hon. mover has rightly pointed out that in Tura and even here in Barabazar, in Nongstoin etc. you will find that most of the shops are run not by our local people but by outsiders. To some extent, Jaintia Hills is better. In some cases, you will find that shops are run by the local people. In Barabazar, there are few shops run by the Khasis. It is noted with regret Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that in places like Rongjeng, Baghmara, Chimmapal, Tura, and in all the markets in central places, we find that even small shops selling combs, hair-oils, lipsticks, shoe-laces, hairpins and so on, are not run by the local people but by outsiders. Well, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think this motion has been very nicely dealt with by the hon. mover himself. He has given a lot of suggestions which are enough food for thought of the Government.

Shri W. Syiemiong :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I wonder if I could be as eloquent as the hon. mover who has spoken before me. But with all my limitations. I feel that I must take part in this very important topic brought in this House by the hon. Member from  Mawlai. Sir, the condition of poverty and unemployment in our State, calls for co-operation from all sides to put our heads together to try to find out ways and means as to how to solve this very very difficult problem. Right from the interior to the rural areas as well as in the urban areas, we have this phenomenon, which may limit in saying, the unemployment problem or rather the ignorance of our people to find out ways and means as to how to employ themselves, is so rampant. Unless something is done to help them, this State of affairs will continue for ever and ever. Sir, the achievement of our State will be of no value because mere political autonomy is not going to help us achieve the other more important factor which is economic recovery. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I know from the side of the Government also, it is very difficult. The hon. mover has suggested a few points as to how Government should would come forward to help the people finds outs ways and means for getting employment and also to encourage them to take advantage of the business opportunities. He has given quite a good number of suggestions to which I may add a few more like dairying, cattle farming. pig rearing, black-smithy, etc. which would easily be developed  in these Hills. But, as I have stated earlier, I think it will be very difficult for the Government also because, to a certain extent the Government have also done something. That I cannot deny. What we would like to suggest is let the Government constitute a Commission to look into the social ills so that the Government of the people would know what would be the remedies. As it is at present, whatever the remedies they would only be a partial cure, and thus, would not solve the problems effectively. So, I want to stress and emphasise that the most important thing is; I believe, that the hon. Members would have the same opinion on constituting a Commission of enquiry to go into the various social ills and make a report of this august House where we will put our heads together to find out ways and means so that all the social ills would be banished. With these few words, Sir, I also support this motion.

Shri S.D.D. Nichols Roy (Minister, Trade and Commerce) :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I would like to, first of all, express my appreciation for the suggestions made by the hon. Member from Mawlai in discussing this motion. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, he has referred very eloquently to the move of the tribal people, particularly of the hill people, for the creation  of a separate State. He has very rightly stressed that no single individual whether A, B, or C should claim responsibility for individually bringing in the State. I could not agree with him more and it applied to all of us that, while each one of us might have played a part, it must have been the work of the people as a whole under the banner of the parties who did participate and which brought about our State. I also agree with him heartily and the creation of the State was, in itself, not a final goal; the State was created so that we could serve the interest of the people of this area as a whole and in particular the economically backward sections of the people.

        It so happened, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that a feeling is created in the minds of many people that just because the tribals are in majority the problem is solved automatically. The mover of the motion has rightly pointed out that in spite of the fact that we have our State-that the tribals are in majority-yet these problems do exist because our people have not been in the habit to taking up opportunities that do exist in society. I also readily agree with this contention that one of the most important factors that the Government and the representatives and the people and all of us have to see is to maintain the population structure and character of the State. Now, Mr. Deputy Speaker Sir, I think we have made it clear on the floor of the House through the Governor's Address and statements made in the past that the Government have already taken up certain programmes to tackle this problem and it was with the intention of solving this problem that the idea of bringing about trade centres and building of certain institutions through the co-operative structure came about and that we would be able to encourage our people to come forward and take up business and trade in the various trade centres. This we have already initiated. I have noticed that the member from Mawlai had brought to the attention of the House a number of problems, particularly the one of influx from outside the State. This was brought to the attention of the Government and we have discussed this matter. We have even brought it to the attention of the Government of India from time to time. Now, in this context, we had initiated and passed an Act but, unfortunately, it did not receive the assent of the President because of certain technicalities on competence of this Legislature. We saw the problem and did something about it and that goes to show to all that we are aware of the problems facing the State. Since that particular Act was not given the assent we have been examining other Acts which are already in force in the Districts level and in the State  level which could be utilised or more actively implemented to solve this problem. The hon. Member from Mawlai has very rightly stressed that certain Acts are already there, such as, the Trading by Non-Tribals Act. It is already in the books of the District Councils and, unfortunately, it has not been actively and proper implemented perhaps and it is with the intention that discussions had been held with the Executive Members of the District Councils recently to try to help implement such Acts so that the  people from outside the State do not get the opportunity to come in and that our own people of our own State are given the encouragement, Now, 3 or 4 hon. Members who spoke before me had mentioned the need of the Government to encourage our own people to take to business and I could not agree with them more but the fact that the Government had not been encouraged outsiders should also be clearly stated. Certainly the Government of Meghalaya do not encourage outsiders to come here and take up business. As a matter of fact, there are provisions at the District Council level which control the land acts and the trading acts and so on. And we do agree that the Government needs to do something more to encourage the people to take to business. I would disagree with Member from Nongstoin when  he has charged that the Ministers in making their tours they go around and I will say in his own words - The only topic of the tour is party organisation' Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I refute this categorically. I know for a fact that in my tours and in the tours of the other Ministers as I have got definite informations and the discussion are held with the representatives of the villages or the areas, we tour for taking up their problems and in meeting their requirements for education, water supply, public health, food supply and so on and so forth. And so, it would be quite wrong to say that Ministers are heavily engaged in the topic of party organisation. Perhaps when we had done all the works, there may be occasions, certain occasion when party organisation came up for discussion sometime. But by and large, in the meetings in the tours, there are the officers who will help the Minister and in this way, we get to know the problems of the people and discuss them to find out ways and means to solve these problems. I would like to inform the Members concerned Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that we have on certain occasions mentioned the opportunities available in our State. Now, it is the duty of the people of the State to take up this opportunities for training in business  and industries particularly, I have mentioned almost on every tour that I undertook that the opportunities do exist for the local people tribal people, to come forward and take up small scale industries and the training of the local people for making them fit to take up these small scale industries, also does exist.

        Now, I would like to refer to the remarks made by the Member from Mawlai on the question of benami transactions. As was stated earlier by my colleague in-charge, of PWD., the Government is very much aware of this problem and I agree that we should try to root out this problem,  but it requires considerable amount of efforts on the part of the administration and on the part of the representative of the people to root out this problem. Also permits, license, loans and various other assistance and facilities are given to the tribal people in business, industries, shops and so on. And whatever permit is being given is in the the name of the tribal people, but we find that the actual persons who are running he shops, etc., are the persons coming from outside the State and this is much against the policy of the Government. We have information about this and it is up to the people to come forward sincerely to take up the facilities, loans and other assistance etc., and, if the tribal people allow these unscrupulous persons to run the business then they would be extremely unfortunate. We are at one with the Members who mentioned this particular problem and we would like to stop and do away with this particular type of  benami transaction. I would like to remind the Members from Mawlai, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, that the Government has today on its books and on its programmes a scheme, a package scheme of incentives for small scale and medium scale industries and a number of our people came forward and started some industries. In addition, the Government has taken step for training of our young people and to find out ways and means how to put small scale industries in our State. There are certain industries that may be set up in our State but our own people do not have the technical know how. So we put them in touch with entrepreneurs form other parts of the country who are willing to help and to be in partnership in a  joint sector in industries if possible. Somebody would like to do small industry work but our people lack the know-how and therefore, we put there in touch with other people in partnership to train them and let them learn the establishment of industries. I would certainly agree with the hon. Member from Mawkyrwat who said that we had to educate our people to be business minded That is what we would like to do and we have started the process of doing it. But I do not agree hundred percent with the remarks made by the Members from Nongstoin that our people are nto business-minded. There are some sections of our people who are quite business-minded like the people of Maharam and Mawsynram the majority of them are known to be contractors and doing different business and their wives and sons are going to the markets and are running shops and we find them in many parts of the rural areas, these people are running business. We would like to encourage them to take up other types of traders also. But there is this saying also that 'nature abhors on vacuum', this is true in human  affairs also. If we do not know how to run a shop or how to set up an industry, then naturally, somebody will come and run the show. Government is aware of these things. But if the District Council does not actually see that these rules are implemented, then whom should we blame - the blame goes to the people running the District Council that people are outside are allowed to do as they like in our State. We accept whole heartedly as a matter for fact, the demand to see that in the new headquarters in the Districts are the local people are engaged in the trade centres and we had already given instructions to start the process of  having trade centres through the co-operative sector. 

        So far as the suggestion made by the Member from Mawlai on the question of preferential treatment to be raised from 7 per cent to 12 per cent is concerned, the Government will have to see whether it will be possible or not. It may involve additional expenditure but it may be worthwhile to have this under consideration. In regard to the Purchase Boards  they are meant to give preferential treatment to local industries. There are already standing orders and we shall look into it. Now, I come to the question of benami licence through marriage.....................


ADJOURNMENT

Mr. Deputy Speaker :- Anyway you could continue tomorrow. The House stands adjourned till 9.30 A.M. tomorrow, the 3rd April, 1976.

R.T. RYMBAI,

Dated Shillong.

Secretary,

the 2nd April, 1976.

Meghalaya Legislative Assembly.