Proceedings of the Budget Session of the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly assembled at 9.30 A.M. on Saturday the 11th June, 1977 in the Assembly Chamber, Shillong with the Speaker in the Chair.


Mr. Speaker :- Let us take up Unstarred question No.86.


(Replies to which were laid on the Table)

Complaint against Police Personnel

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah asked :

86.    Will the Minister be pleased to state -

(a) Whether it is a fact that lately a complaint was lodged against police personnel at Phulbari by one Sahajudpdew, Pound Keeper of Sirgimari Cattle Pound ?

(b) If so, what action has been taken and who is the enquiry officer, if any ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

86. (a) & (b) - No, However, a complaint petition submitted by Abdus Samad Sk. and others was received recently and its way duly enquired into by the Superintendent of Police, Garo Hills, Tura.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, may we know the nature of the complaint ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The complaint issued against the police was submitted to the Chief Minister by the young of Rajabala under the signature of Abdus Samad Sk. and 91 others condemning the police action in involving Shri. Majibur Rahman, President of Rajabala village Council in a police case against Shri. Shajuddin, Pound Keeper of Hallidayganj cattle pound. The Superintendent of Police, Garo Hills, Tura enquired into the matter and a report submitted. The enquiry report reveals certain alleged criminal activities of one Shahjuddin and not Sahajuddew as mentioned in the question.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- At what stage the enquiry stands today ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The complaint was lodged by one Md. Abdul Kader Kazi of Perchakandi of Phulbari P.S. on 9th December, 1976 to the effect that on 2nd December, 1976 about 11 P.M. his 2 head of she-buffaloes were located in the house of one Md. Sahajudding of Kacharipara. The complainant demanded the buffalo but Md. Shajuddin refused to return them. The value of the buffaloes would be Rs.500 No. receipt of the complaint Phulbari P.S. Case No.5 (12th December), 1976 U/s 379/411 I.P.C. was registered and during investigation it transpired that the complainant had purchased the said 2 heads of buffaloes along with 16 more heads from one Indra Bahadur Chetri of Chamkhanggiri at Rs.4500 on 29th November, 1976 and used to keep all the buffaloes near the rice mill of Abdul Kazi and Surajzamal of Perchakandi. On the night of 2nd December, 1976, 2 heads of buffaloes were stolen away by somebody by cutting the ropes. Thereafter, the complainant searched for the stolen buffaloes and discovered them in the cattle pound of Sahajuddin sk. Kacharipara.

Incidence of Crime In Mawhati

Prof. M.N. Majaw asked :

87.    Will the Chief Minister be pleased state -

(a) Whether the State Government has examined the incidence of crime in the Mawhati area and if so, what steps are being taken to control it.

(b) Whether the Government proposes to open a Police Outpost at Mawhati or its immediate vicinity ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

87.    (a) - Yes, Police take action as required under law on cases reported to them.

        (b) - This is being examined.

Shri. S.P. Swer :- May we know the police station nearest to Mawhati area ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The nearest police station is at Umsning.

Shri. H. Hadem :- What is the distance between Mawhati and Umsning ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- About 40 kilo meters.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- How long has the proposal to open a police station at Mawhati been under the consideration of the Government ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Before we come to a decision to open a police station, the matter would be examined.

Prof. A. Warjri :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, it falls under what police station ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Subject to correction it falls under the Nongpoh Police station.

Arrest of the President of Rajabala Village Council

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah asked :

88.    Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state -

(a) Whether it is a fact that one Majibur Rahman, President of Rajabala Village Council was arrested by the Police on the even of the Lok Sabha elections ?

(b) If the reply is in the affirmative, details of arrest and public complaint if any, may please be given.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

88.   (a) - He was arrested on 7th February 1977.

        (b) - He was charge sheeted under Sections 409/429/511/109, Indian Penal Code.

        The case is now subjudice.

Public Health Unit at Sadew, Upper Shillong

Shri. J.M. Syiem asked :

89.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Health be pleased to state -

(a) Whether Public Health Unit Hospital at Sadew, Upper Shillong, has since been completed ?

(b) Whether the Health Department has taken over the buildings from the Public Works Department ?

(c) If not, what do Government propose to do with the said buildings before the Health Unit is opened ?

(d) When can the inauguration of the Unit be expected to take place ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister-in-charge, of Health)  replied :

89.    (a) - Yes, except water connection.

        (b) - No.

        (c) - To take over and start the out patient wing.

        (d) - As soon as possible within this year.

Prof. A. Warjri :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, whether Government in making the estimates or this hospital has provided the cost of water connection ?

Mr. Speaker :- I think that is a new question. I did not get it.

Prof. A. Warjri :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, whether water connection has been provided in the estimate ?

Mr. Speaker :- That is a new question I think.

Prof. A. Warjri :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, the reply to (a) is except water connection ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- I require notice for that.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, may we know when was the building apart from water connection completed?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, long ago we had completed it but I cannot give the exact date.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- It may be 10 years back.

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- I am not in a position to tell the exact date.

Shri. S.P. Swer :- Whether the hospital has its own water supply scheme ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- The answer is clear. Because of no water we could not open it.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- What is the problem of water connection ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- Because the location of the hospital is at the top of the existing water sources. We are trying to find out some other sources.

Shri. Dlosingh Lyngdoh :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, question 89 (a) is like this. Whether the Public Health Unit Hospital at Sadew Upper Shillong, has since been completed ? And the reply is yes except water connection. May I know whether water supply has been investigated ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- We are trying to get water from the air force and if we cannot get water from them we will try some other sources.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to correct the name of the police station I mentioned before. It is Shillong Police Station.

Names of Secretaries, Deputy Secretaries, etc. of
Meghalaya Government

Shri. H. Hadem asked :-

90.    Will the Chief Minister be pleased to lay a statement showing the names of the Deputy Secretaries : Secretaries, Under Secretaries and Directors of the Government of Meghalaya with the Department (s) allotted to each indicating their Community (Tribal Non-Tribals) ?

Shri. Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :

90.    - A statement showing the names of the Secretaries, Additional Secretaries, Joint Secretaries, Deputy Secretaries and Under Secretaries to the Government of Meghalaya and of the Heads of Departments indicating their Community (Tribal / Non-Tribal) is placed on the table of the House.

Shri. H. Hadem :- May I know whether all these officers are in the Joint cadre ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Not all the officers but only those of the I.A.S. Cadre.

Shri. H. Hadem :- When does the Government propose to separate the Joint Cadre of the I.A.S. from that of Assam?

Mr. Speaker :- I think this implies that unless the Reorganisation Act is amended there is no proposal till today.

Duty of the Officer-in-charge of Meghalaya House, Calcutta

Shri. Samarendra Sangma asked :

91.    Will the Chief Minister be pleased to state whether it is a para of the duty of the officer-in-charge of the Meghalaya House Calcutta to see to the Governments of the members of the various Assembly Committees of Meghalaya passing through Calcutta ?

Shri. Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :-

91.    - If the Members of the Assembly Committee of Meghalaya do not stay in the Meghalaya House, Calcutta, it is not the duty of the Officer-in-charge, Meghalaya House, Calcutta, to see the requirement of the Members.

Shri. H. Hadem :- If they stay in the Meghalaya House is it the duty of the officer in charge to see to their requirements ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- If they stay in the Meghalaya House it is the duty of the officer in-charge to look to their requirements.

Tourist Office in Calcutta

Shri. Dlosingh Lyngdoh asked :-

92.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Tourism be pleased to state -

(a) Whether it is a fact that Government have established Tourist Office / Cell with tribal officers in Calcutta, Gauhati and New Delhi.

(b) Whether it is a fact that the Tourist Officers in Calcutta has been placed under the Officer-in-charge of Meghalaya House Calcutta ?

(c) If the reply to (b) above be in the negative, whether a suitable office room in the Meghalaya House with sufficient staff has been provided to the said Tourist Officer ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister-in-charge of Tourism) replied :-

92.    (a) - Tourist offices at Calcutta and Delhi has been established under the charge of Tourist Officers who both are tribals. There is no Tourist Officer at Gauhati. At Gauhati there is a Tourist Information Centre under the Officer-in-charge of Movement Office who belongs to the Department of Supply. The Officer-in-charge at Gauhati is a non-tribal.

        (b) - As far as the work of Tourism Department is concerned the Tourist Officer at Calcutta functions independently. The Trade Adviser - cum - Director of Movement of the Government of Meghalaya at Calcutta acts as the controlling Officer in respect of the office of the Tourist Officer, which is accommodated in one of the rooms of the Meghalaya House.

        (c) - One room has been provided for the office of the Tourist Officer in the Meghalaya House, Calcutta. At present the Tourist Officer is not provided with other junior staff.

Dlosingh Lyngdoh :- The answer to 92 (b) is not clear because at the beginning it says the Tourist Officer at Calcutta functions independently but again in the next sentence it says that the Trade Adviser-cum- Director of Movement of the Government of Meghalaya at Calcutta acts as the Controlling Officer in respect of the Tourist Officer at Calcutta. Is the Tourist Officer at Calcutta entrusted with works besides his own ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Tourism) :- I think the answer is clear. (b) - As far as the work of Tourism Department is concerned the Tourist Officer at Calcutta functions independently because the office is situated in Meghalaya House. The trade Adviser - cum - Director of Movements of the Government of Meghalaya at Calcutta acts the Controlling Officer in respect of the Office of the Tourist Officer which is accommodated in one of the rooms of the Meghalaya House which is under the direct control of the Trade Adviser.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Is there any contemplation to have a separate Tourist Officer at Calcutta.

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Tourism) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, not a moment.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- 92 (a), whether this Tourist Officer is provided with accommodation at the Meghalaya House?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Tourism) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I require notice for that question.

Shri. H. Hadem :- 92 (c), can this Tourist Officer in the Meghalaya House function single-handed ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Tourism) :- At the moment the work load is less and he is working singly.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- How many tourists this Tourist Officer met on the average per day ?

Mr. Speaker :- That is a new question.

Exemption of entertainment tax in M/S Theatrical Lovers' Troups

Shri. Jackman Marak asked :-

93.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Taxation be pleased to state -

(a) Whether it is a fact that the show entitled "Allaudin' by Calcutta Puppet Show from Calcutta had taken place recently in the State Central Library from 21st May 1977 upto 23rd May 1977as sponsored by M/S Technical Lovers' Troups Shillong.

(b) If so, whether the party concerned was allowed so organise the show free of tax thereby causing loss of Government revenue ?

(c) If not, what was the total amount of tax so far collected ?

(d) The name of the authority who issued the order for exemption of tax and the letter number and date thereof may please be furnished.

Shri. Upstar Kharbuli (Minister of State, Taxation) replied :-

93.    (a) - Yes.

        (b) - The party was granted exemption from payment of entertainment tax under Section 8 (2) of the Amusement and Betting Tax Act for the promotion of cultural and educational activities and in consideration of the philanthropic objective of the organisers.

        (c) - Does not arise.

        (d) - The exemption order was issued by Government, vide letter No. CTAB - 2/76/536, dated 27th May, 1977 (placed on the Table of the House).

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- 93. (b), what are the philanthropic objectives of the organisers of the Puppet Show ?

Shri. U. Kharbuli (Minister of State, Taxation) :- According to their statement, the profit will be utilised in giving financial and to the various theatrical clubs in the State and also some percentage of the profit be contributed to the cancer project.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Here the question in 93 (a) is whether it is a fact that the show entitled 'Allaudin' by Calcutta Puppet Show from Calcutta had been taken place recently in the State Central Library from 21st May upto 23rd May 1977 as sponsored by M/s Theatrical Lover's Troupe, Shillong. This show was started on 21st May. But the Government order for exemption of the tax was issued on 27th May, 1977. My question is how it is possible on the part of the Government to issue exemption order on the 27th May, 1977 ? I want to know what is the state of affairs?

Mr. Speaker :- How can the Minister reconcile the information given in reply to 93 (d) with that given to reply 93 (a) ?

Shri. U. Kharbuli (Minister of State, Taxation) :- Sir, there is something like red-tapism in the Government Departments. It usually takes some time to decide whether to grant exemption or not.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- How can the show be held when the exemption order was not issued, this is not quite irrelevant but quite surprising !

Mr. Speaker :- But when it is done for philanthropic purpose as the Minister has said, I think the exemption order could have been issued much later.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- According to the rules it is not obligatory that the show  cannot be started unless the order for exemption is issued by Government. The exemption could be given by the Government later on.

Price Rise at Essential Commodities

Shri. W. Syiemiong asked :-

94.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Supply be pleased to State -

(a) Whether Government are aware that the price of many essential commodities have gone up recently ?

(b) If so, what are those commodities ?

(c) What action has the Government taken to arrest the spiralling prices ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister-in-charge of Civil Supplies) replied :-

94.    (a) - Yes, price of some essential commodities have gone up recently.

        (b) - Pulses and edible oils including vegetable ghee.

        (c) - Our first concern is to ensure easy availability of all items of essential commodities and for which a strict watch is being maintained on the situation. The prices are also being monitored and co-operation from the traders has been obtained to keep the prices as low as possible in relation to the prices prevailing in procurement centres. Government of India have also been approached for allocating some stock of rapeseeds oil for the State to ease the situation in edible oil. Display of prices and stocks are being strictly enforced.

        Recently Government have set up a State Level Monitoring Committee to keep a constant watch over the situation and take corrective measures.

Shri. H. Hadem :- 94 (c), may we know what is meant by that rapeseed oil ?

Mr. Speaker :- I think you are only trying to get the meaning of the word. You may consult either the Chamber's or Oxford Dictionary.

Shri. H. Hadem :- I tried Sir, but I could not find (laughter).

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- May we know the nature of co-operation that the Government obtained from the traders ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- I should say the cooperative is very health.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- I say the nature of cooperation, Sir, that the Government obtained from the traders because it is clearly written in reply to (c) that the prices are also being monitored and cooperation from the traders has been obtained. So we would like to know the nature of the cooperation.

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- The cooperation is in building up the stock and controlling the prices.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- 94(c), when has the traders agreed to lower down the prices ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- The traders have agreed that they should not take profit more than they deserve.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- How often has the State level Monitoring Committee met in the last few months ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- Twice a month on Friday.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- May we know who comprise the Committee ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- The members of the State level Monitoring Committee are (1) Secretary, Food & Civil Supplies Department, Chairman (2) Director of Information & Public Relations. (3) Director of Statistics & Economics (4) Station Director of All India Radio, Shillong (5) Managing Director, Meghalaya State Coopt. Marketing and Consumer Federation (6) Director of Supply (7) Deputy Commissioner, Shillong. (8) Representative of Police and official members. Five members from amongst importers and wholesalers. Three Government Stockists, four members from the retailers Association one member from the co-operation retail outlets and the Frontier Chamber of Commerce.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Any representative from the consumers ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- The hon. Member has crossed three supplementaries, Sir.

Prof. A. Warjri :- 94. (c), whether there has been any allocation order of rapeseeds in the State ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- We have applied but we have not got the allotment order.

Shri. Rowell Lyngdoh :- 94. (c), whether there was any representative from the consumers in that Committee ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- At present we have not member representing the consumers in the Committee. But there was a proposal that the consumers will be co-opted when they decide among themselves.

Mr. Speaker :- You mean to say that the Committee will have the power to co-opt and the procedure is yet to be finalised.

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Civil Supplies) :- Yes, Sir.

Stockists and Wholesalers of Rice in the State

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah asked :-

95.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Supply be pleased to state the names of the rice stockists and rice wholesalers in each district of Meghalaya ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister in charge of Supply) replied :-

95.    - There are no stockists exclusively for rice. There are however 3 Government stockists, namely, M/s E.M. and Sons, Shillong, M/s. B. K.J.P. Prasad, Shillong and M/s K. C. Jaisukhlall, Shillong who have also been granted licences for sale and storage of foodgrains under the provision of Meghalaya Foodgrains (Licensing Control) Order, 1972. The name of wholesalers dealing in rice in each district of Meghalaya are as follows :-

East Khasi Hills - 10 Nos.


Shri. Washington Marbaniang, Shillong.


M/s Omprakash, Shiv Kumar, Shillong.


Shri. Modrik Nongkynrih, Shillong.


Shri. E.G. Marbaniang, Shillong.


Smti. Krom Rapsang, Shillong.


The Shillong Consumers Co-operative Wholesale Store Ltd. Shillong.


Smti. D. Rani, Cherrapunjee.


Shri. Ashim Laloo, Mawsynran.


M/s Farmcos Multipurpose Co-operative Society Smit.


Shri. Stalin Suting, Pynursla.

Jaintia Hills 3 Nos.


Shri. Khroo Kyndiah, Jowai.


M/s. Mahabir Trading Agency, Jowai.


Jowai Consumers Co-operative Stores, Jowai.

East Garo Hills - 5 Nos.


S.N. Prasad, Williamnagar.


 Jamir Sangma, Mendipathar.


J.L. Sangma, Rongjeng.


N. Mishra, Songsak.


M. Sangma, Bajendoba.

West Khasi Hills - 6 Nos.


Shri. S.S. Rajee, Nongstoin.


Smti. C. Rynjah, Nongstoin.


Shri. B. Nongrum, Nongstoin.


M/s Lyngam Nongtrai Sub-Area Marketing Society, Riangdo.


M/s Mawkyrwat Sub-Area Co-operative Marketing Society Ltd., Mawkyrwat.


M/s Western Border Sub-Area Marketing Society, Trongpleng.

West Garo Hills including Baghmara Sub divisoin - 27 Nows.


M/s K.K. Nath, Tura.


M/s R.R. S. Prasad, Tura.


Chiranjilal Ramjilal, Tura.


M/s Gauhati Grain Trades, Tura.


 Shri. K.L. Jajodia, Tura.


S.N. Prasad, Tura.


C.L. Khandelwal, Tura.


Shri. Gopal Prasad Ranior, Tura.


Shri. Rabi Barman, Tura.


Shri. S.C. Das, Tura.


Shri. Misorsing Sangma, Tura.


Secretary, Meghalaya Young Traders Co-operative Society, Tura.


Shri. Gopal Prasad Ranior, Rongram.


Shri. N.K. Tewari and Brothers, Zikzak.


M/s. K.K. Nath, Phulbari.


Shri. Ram Chandra Thakur, Selsella.


Shri. A. Rahaman, Rajabala.


Surat Zaman, Bhatbari.


Abdul Hussain Mondahall, Haldiganj.


Shri. R. Barman, Tikrikilla.


M/s Monoj Trading Company, Betasing.


Chiran Sub-Area Marketing Co-operative Society, Phulbari.


Dal Sub-Area Marketing Society, Dalu.


Shri. Jongjing Sangma, Dadengiri.


M/s. Meghalaya Store, Baghmara.


Baghmara Sub-Area Marketing Co-operative Society, Baghmara.


Kalu Marak, Baghmara.

Nongpoh Sub division - 3 Nos.


Klaitan Nongsiej, Umsning.


Elington Syngkli, Nongpoh.


Burnihat Sub-Area Marketing Co-operative Society, Burnihat.

Mairang Sub division - 1 No.


Sairen Marwein, Pyndemumiong Mairang.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Who are the stockists and not exclusively for rice ?

Mr. Speaker :- That is a new question because the question is only to stockists for rice.

Provincialisation of certain Schools in the State

Shri. S.P. Swer asked :-

96.    Will the Minister-in- charge of Education be pleased to state :-

(a) The names of High English School, the Government propose to provincialise ?

(b) The names of Private High English Schools, the Government propose to place under the Deficit System ?

(c) The names of Private Middle English Schools, the Government propose to provincialise ?

(d) The names of Private Middle English Schools the Government propose to place under the Deficit System?

Shri. P.G. Marbaniang (Minister-in-charge of Education) replied :-

96. (a) to (d) - The feasibility of provincialising or bringing certain schools under deficit system is duly examined by Government  every year keeping in view of the financial position of the State. At the moment no school is proposed to be provincialised or brought under deficit system as funds have been eroded by the implementation of the Revised Pay scales to Teachers with effect from 1st April, 1975.

Grants-in-Aid for Social and Cultural Organisation

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah asked :-

97.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Social Welfare be pleased to state -

(a) The names of non-officials organisations which received grants-in-aid for social and cultural work during 1976-77 with amount granted to each ?

(b) Whether there is an advisory Committee which recommended the sanction of financial  aid to the grantees ?

Shri. P.G. Marbaniang (Minister, Social Welfare) replied :

97.     (a) - The list is placed on the table of the House.

        (b) - Yes. There is a Screening Committee / Selection Committee which recommend the sanction of financial aids to the granters.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- 97. (b), Who are the members of the Screening Committee ?

Shri. P.G. Marbaniang (Minister, Social Welfare) :- The Screening Committee was constituted for a period of three years with effect from 26th February 1975 to help the Directorate I distribution of the various social welfare grants. The following are the members of the Committee.

        1. The Director of Social Welfare, Chairman (2). The Deputy Director of Social Welfare, Secretary (3) The Chairman, Meghalaya State Social welfare, Advisory Board, Member (4) The District Social Welfare Officer, Shillong, member.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- May we know whether the Government accepts the recommendations of the Committee ?

Shri. P.G. Marbaniang (Minister, Social Welfare) :- Naturally,.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- May we know, Sir, whether in all cases the Government has accepted the recommendations of the Committee ?

Jail Manual

Prof. M.N. Majaw asked :-

98.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Jails be pleased to state -

(a) Whether the Jails in the State are governed by the rules laid down in the Assam Jail Manual ?

(b) If so,

(i) When was this manual first drawn up and applied to the District Jail at Shillong ?

(ii) When was this manual last amended ?

(iii) How much does the manual lay down as dietary expenditure per diem for each prisoners ?

(iv) Can a prisoner sentenced to rigorous imprisonment be fed satisfactorily with the money sanctioned per diem ?

(v) If not, what has the Government done all these years to ensure healthy meals to all their prisoners ?

(vi) Whether under hardened criminals undergoing imprisonment for their crimes, in the State Jails ?

(d) Whether the Assam Jail Manual lays down rules for the segregation of different classes of prisoners ?

Shri. D.D. Lapang (Minister of State-in-charge of Jails) replied :-

98.    (a) - Yes.

        (b) -

(i) It was drawn up in 1899. It applies to the District Jails, Shillong since then.

(ii) In 1925.

(iii) The quantum of dietary articles to be given to each prisoner in as per scale laid down in the Jail Manual.

(iv) The scale is considered adequate.

(v) Does not arise.

(vi) No.

        (d) - Yes.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- When was the diet last fixed or determined ?

Shri. D.D. Lapang (Minister of State i/c of Jail) :- At the time when the Assam Jail Manual came into force and amended in 1925.

Shri. R. Lyngdoh :- In reply to (b) (vi) above, may we know Sir, where are they accommodated ?

Shri. D.D. Lapang (Minister of State i/c of Jail) :- At Shillong Jail with its branches at Mawlai and Tripura Castle road.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Whether the Government is contemplating to revise the manual now ?

Shri. D.D. Lapang (Minister of State i/c of Jail) :- I want notice.

Vehicles run by the Assam State Road Transport Corporation

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah asked :-

99.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Transport be pleased to state the number of vehicles run by the Assam State Road Transport Corporation on G.S. Route giving the breakup of vehicles run under the award of the Government of India and the additional vehicles allowed by the Meghalaya Transport Corporation ?

Shri. F.W. Mawlot (Minister of State, Transport) replied :-

99.    Under Government of India's award the number of vehicles runs by the Assam State Road Transport Corporation are as follows :-






8 permits.






20 permits







        No additional permits were granted by the Meghalaya Transport Corporation to the Assam State Transport Corporation.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Whether Government is aware of the fact that an Assam State Road Transport Corporation bus is running between Garompani and Shillong.

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State Transport) :- We are aware of the buses running from Shillong to Silchar and not from Shillong to Garompani.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- May we know since when they were running ?

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State, Transport) :- Right from the beginning of the Assam State Road Transport Corporation ?

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Whether there is any proposal now to grant additional permit to the A.S.R.T.C. ?

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State Transport) :- There is a proposal from the Assam State Road Transport Corporation but then we have to examine it.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Whether it is a fact the D.T.O. prosecuted a vehicle under the provision of the Motor Vehicle Act for overloading ? If so, may we know from the Minister-in-charge the number of vehicle and the date of prosecution?

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State, Transport) :- I require notice Mr. Speaker, Sir.

Registered Vehicles in Jaintia Hills District

Shri. H.E. Pohshna asked :-

100.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Transport be pleased to state -

(a) How many vehicles have so far been registered by the District Transport Officer, Jowai ?

(b) How many taxi permits have been issued to car owners (the names and address of each permit holders may be stated) ?

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State, Transport) replied :-

100. (a) - 355 (three hundred fifty five) vehicles

        (b) - 10 (ten) temporary local taxi permits have been issued so far -

1. Shri. Ramjamin Nonghuloo, son of late Riang Bareh, Lulong, Jowai

MLJ - 27

2. Shri. Wajjopbai Lakiang, son of Shri. K. Rymbai, Lulong, Jowai.

MLJ - 287

3. Captain Vijay Mohun, son of Shri. Man Mohum, Lulong, Jowai.

MLJ - 5111

4. Hamlet Synrem, son of E. Blah, Chutwakhu, Jowai

MLS - 2682

5.  Shri. Anil Kumar Lahiri, son of late S.N. Lahiri, Iewmusiang, Jowai

MLJ - 297

6. Shri. Pril Jyrwa, son of Sarong Lyngdoh, Iewmusiang, Jowai

MLJ - 272

7. Shri. Jihon Shilla, son of Sabiang Lyngdoh, Sabahmuswang, Jowai

MLJ - 2111

8. Shri. Khlur Jyrwa, son of N. Surong, New Hills Jowai

MLS - 168

9. Shri. Sirjuddin Ahmed, son of Abdul Kida, Khliehshong, Chilliangraj, Jowai.

MLS - 4936

10. Shri. Darwin Sumer, Khliehshnong, Chilliangraj, Jowai

MLS - 2683

Kalachar - Zigzak Gobinath Tilla road

Shri. Samarendra Sangma asked :-

101.    Will the Minister-in-charge of P.W.D. be pleased to state.

(a) Whether Government is aware that people are suffering due to the very deplorable condition of the Kalaichar - Zigzak - Gobinath Tilla, P.W.D. Road ?

(b) If so, whether Government propose to give due attention to the need for improvement of the said P.W.D. Road ?

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, P.W.D.) replied :-

101. (a) - No.

        (b) - Government has already called for the estimate to improve the road.

Financial benefits for the State Transport Corporation Employees

Shri. Samarendra Sangma asked :-

102.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Transport be pleased to state -

(a) Whether the employees of the State Transport Corporation are getting all the financial benefits as their counterparts in other States ?

(b) Whether the drivers and other employees of the State Transport Corporation are getting their over duty charges ?

(c) If so, at what rates ?

(d) Whether the drives and other employees of the State Transport Corporation are being given and trip allowance ?

(e) If so, at what rate ?

Shri. Williamson A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :-

102.    (a) The financial benefits being enjoyed by employees of State Transport Corporations of other States are not known.

        (b) - Only drivers and conductors are entitled to over time payment.

        (c) - The rate of overtime pay for both drivers and conductors is at 11/2 of the rate of their ordinary wages per hour.

        (d) - Only drives and conductors are entitled to trip allowance.

        (e) - Rate of trip allowance are as follows :-

(i) Driver of ordinary bus at Rs.0.026 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs.2.00

(ii) Conductor of ordinary bus at Rs.0.021 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs.1.60

(iii) Driver of express but at Rs.0.031 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs.2.

(iv) Conductor of express but at Rs.0.025 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs..60.

(v) Driver of super express bus at Rs.0.039 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs.2.

(vi) Conductor of super express bus at Rs.0.031 per km. subject to a minimum of Rs.1.60.

(vii) Truck driver at Rs.0.033 per km.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- In reply to question 102 (b) Sir, whether conductors and drivers are entitled to bonus from the Corporation ?

Shri. F.K. Mawlot (Minister of State, Transport) :- No, Sir.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, in reply to (a) above, may we know what are the benefits given to the State Transport employees ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Yes, Mr. Speaker, Sir. They get their usual pay and allowances.

Shri. Humphrey Hadem :- Sir, whether the dues of these conductors and their trip allowances have been granted up till today ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- That seems to be a new question and I want notice for that.

Meghalaya Transport Corporation

Shri. Jormanick Syiem asked :-

103.    Will the Minister-in-charge of Transport be pleased to state -

(a) How many vehicles are there in the fleet of the Meghalaya State Transport Corporation ?

(b) How many of them are in serviceable condition, how many are unserviceable and how many have been condemned ?

(c) Whether it is a fact that there is no Chief Automobile Engineer at present ?

(d) If so, who is in-charge of the vehicles ?

(e) What are the reasons for the resignation of the erstwhile Chief Automobile Engineer ?

(f) Whether the Government proposes to appoint another Chief Automobile Engineer ?

(g) If so, whether the post has since been advertised ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) replied :-

103. (a) - One hundred and sixty-eight (including buses, trucks and Ambassador Cars).

        (b) - Serviceable - 79.

Unserviceable - 79

Condemned - Nil.

        (c) - Yes.

        (d) - An Automobile Engineer is in-charge of the workshop at Shillong.

        (e) - The erstwhile Chief Automobile Engineer did not resign.        

        (f) - This is under consideration of the Meghalaya Transport Corporation.

        (g) - No.

Shri. Jormanik Syiem :- In reply to (b) above, Sir, may we know what happened to the unserviceable vehicles?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The condemned vehicles will have to be seen whether they will be still reparable or not.

Shri. Jormanick Syiem :- Where are these kept ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I want notice, Sir.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- In reply to (d) above, may we know the name of the Chief Automobile Engineer in-charge of the workshop at Shillong ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I do not have the records here Sir.

Mr. Speaker :- In any case, the question is linked up with another question and for that, the Chief Minister requires notice.

Shri. Rowell Lyngdoh :- In reply to (e) above, if the Government still require the services of the Chief Automobile Engineer ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Yes, and the matter is being pursued ?

Shri. Rowell Lyngdoh :- Sir, whether this present automobile engineer is appointed on promotion of direct recruitment ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- He was there in the organisation.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- In reply to (d) above, how many workshops are there in the State ?

Mr. Speaker :- From the answer here it appears that there is a workshop here in Shillong.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- My point is that there is also a workshop at Tura.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Now from the reply of the Chief Minister it appears that the post of automobile engineer may have to be filled up. May we know whether it was advertised ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Sir, this matter is being pursued and in the Board's meeting the question of considering the case of one Mr. Hynniewta is being discussed and a report from the Transport Department is being asked because he was also deputed from Nagaland where the Department is running this service. When we get the report we will pursue the matter.

Shri. K.M. Roy Marbaniang :- Since when the post was lying vacant ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Since the Corporation came into being.

Shri. Rowell Lyngdoh :- What is the position of the Chief Automobile Engineer since he did not resign uptil now ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- His services were requisitioned from the Government of Nagaland with effect from 12th March, 1976 and we have reverted him to the Government of Nagaland on 24th December 1976 whereas he did not join the post under the parent department yet he has availed earned leave of four months upto 21st April 1977. Now we have appointed Shri. H. Syiemlieh in his place.

Shri. K.M. Roy Marbaniang :- Who looks after the job of the Chief Automobile Engineer ?

Mr. Speaker :- The Chief Minister has supplied all the information regarding this question ?

Dietary expenditure of Civil Hospital

Prof. M.N. Majaw asked :-

104.     Will the Minister-in-charge of Health be pleased to state -

(a) What was the sanctioned rate for daily dietary expenditure for each patient in General Wards of the Civil Hospital, Shillong, during 1974-75 ?

(b) Was this daily rate increased subsequently ?

(c) If so -

(i) What is the daily rate per head today ?

(ii) Has there been any appreciable improvement in the Hospital authorities as a result of the increased rate ?

(iii) What was the average number of patients in the Hospital per day during 1976-77 ?

(iv) Have the Hospital authorities submitted accounts for dietary expenses on all patients of the hospital?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister-in-charge of Health) replied :

104. (a) - The sanctioned rate for daily dietary expenditure was Rs.2.25 p per patient per day during 1974-75.

        (d) - Yes, with effect from 28th May 1975/

        (e) - 

(i) The daily rate is Rs.4.50 per patient per day.

(ii) Yes.

(iii) The average number of patients was 200 per day during 1976-77.

(iv) Yes.

Prof. M. N. Majaw :- Are we to understand that the hospital authorities have submitted accounts for the supply of diet to the patient who do not take food ? Or am I do understand that alternative arrangements are being made for those patients who do not take food ?

Mr. Speaker :- This is argumentative because any patient may need some food.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Because there are some patients who take food from outside, those who take only liquid and saline water, what were the dietary expenses for those patients who did not take food ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- The hon. Member knows thoroughly well and he will answer every question by himself.

Mr. Speaker :- But the House must know also. It is not only for the benefit of one hon. Member. It is for the benefit of the whole House.

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- Already pointed out by the hon. Member, some patients do not take food. Some of them are local, some patients are from outside and they take food. It is extremely difficult on the part of the hospital authorities to see each and every patient who takes saline water, liquid or some other solid food.

Mr. Speaker :- In other words, all patients must have to take food.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the accommodation commensurate with the inflow of the patients ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- No, Sir.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- In that case what are the steps being taken by the Government to meet the need of accommodation ?

Shri. S.K. Marak (Minister, Health) :- Well Mr. Speaker, Sir, as I had informed yesterday in this very House that people have become so much hospital and medicine- minded. At present we can increase the bed strength from 150 to 200. We have among other things, even a re-thinking just to construct another, building hereby in future. We are thinking in that line.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- But are the hospital authorities aware of the fact that there is a separate room allotted to the office of the Head Assistant of the hospital which could be used for accommodating more patients ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- It is not a question of place as correctly replied by the Health Minister, it is a question of fund.

Mr. Speaker :- Let us pass on to the next item. Prof. M.N. Majaw to raise a matter of grave importance during the zero hour under Rule 49 (A).

Zero Hour

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, if I am right, I submitted three items and I may be allowed to raise all the three items.

Mr. Speaker :- It is a private members' business day, you can raise all three.

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Parliamentary Affairs) :- May I have a clarification to the answer that I made yesterday ?

Mr. Speaker :- No, until I call you when the turn comes. The zero hour comes first.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, the first item that I propose to raise is a very serious matter, a matter which caused the overthrow of the President of another country. I am referring to telephone tapping. In other parts of the world it is considered to be highly illegal or highly unconstitutional. I do not know for what reason some telephones are being tapped nor do know the purpose but certainly when we pick up the phone we can hear the main lie being disturbed and a rumbling sound comes on the line. I know from some sources that the Home Department has a machine to which about 100 lines are connected. Some of them were allegedly connected to the Members' phones. So I would like to bring to the notice of the Government the fact that this is a very very unfortunate matter that the telephone of the hon. Members of the House should be tapped. Whatever might be the reason, we would like to have an assurance on this matter. We have raised this twice in this august House. But the reply is always evasive. We would like to have a categorical statement as to whether the Government is going to continue with this tapping or not. We would like to know whether Intelligence wing of the Home Department is going to continue tapping our telephones. It is not just one but it is happening every now and then.

Mr. Speaker :- In fact, the very important point is if there has been any inconvenience in tapping of the telephones of the hon. Member. I may say that tapping of telephones of some suspected persons usually is made in Shillong. I would like to hear the matter from the Chief Minister.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, disturbances take place when you are talking on the telephone. No.1 sometimes there is a cross-connection but in so far as tapping in concerned, it may be illegal in other countries but it is legal in our country. The 1885 Central Act gives power to the Government to tap and to direct interception on the telephone if it is in the interest of public safety and integrity of our country. Government has got power to intercept the line under the Indian Posts and Telegraph Act, 1898 for the safety of the public and the integrity of the country. This is also a Central Act which the State Government takes recourse to this power only for that purpose by law. It is not a fact that action is being taken immediately by the Government or by any authority of the State Government. It is under the provision of the relevant law for the safety and integrity of the country.

Mr. Speaker :- In any case you have replied to both points No.1 and

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- I have not raised the second point. On a point of clarification we would like to know whether the telephones of the hon. Members of the House can be tapped. I want a categorical statement on this.

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- As a matter of fact, it is being tapped. Whether the telephone of the hon. Members of the House can be tapped ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I cannot reply.

Mr. Speaker :- In this particular case, if there is importance of consideration by the Government or by the State that certain persons are being suspected to disturb public safety and integrity of the country, the Government cannot disclose the secret. But I appeal to the hon. Members that if they find that their phones are being tapped, they can make a complaint to appropriate authorities because I do not believe that the hon. Members of the House would really be suspected of any of these activities. I do not say that the Chief Minister has referred to it but the matter raised by Prof. M.N. Majaw is also concerned with many other persons.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- May I make a submission Mr. Speaker, Sir. My request for raising this matter during the zero hour was primarily, if you will recall the correspondence regarding the tapping of the telephones of M.L.As, and then of public leaders. But now, with particular reference to the M.L.As, may I humbly submit that this Government is responsible to this House - the Ministry is responsible to this House. Therefore, some information, without affecting the security of the country, should be permissible. The Ministry is responsible to this House and so we would also like to know who are the persons who are doing the tapping. To our knowledge, they belong to the lower scholons in power. Whether, they are qualified and able to distinguish between conservations of an anti-State nature and other conservations because, Mr. Speaker, Sir, there may be an interference with our rights as Members of this House. There may be conversations between the M.L.As which do not affect the security of the State but which may be great advantage to a political party or the powers that be. It may create new problems which may not be discussed threadbare here. So may we have more information ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would appeal to you that, as I said earlier in the interest of public security and integrity of the State, it is not possible for me to divulge it. If it is done then the purpose would be defeated.

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, you have advised the hon. Members that if they have any reasons to think that their telephones had been tapped, they may complain to the authorities. But from the reply of the Chief Minister, it appears that there is no room for complaint.

Mr. Speaker :- I have not made my observation on this matter. The Chief Minister has explained that in matters concerning public safety and security of the country, the Government has the right to keep it a secret. But if the telephone of any of the hon. Members of the House is being tapped to such an extend that it disturbs the hon. Member's functioning as a Member, that is a separate issue. As I have said earlier, here there is no specific case. The hon. Member from Mawhati has raised the matter in a general term which, I think, is difficult for me to make more observations than that because if it goes further it becomes a privilege case it is disturbs him in the functioning of his duties.

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- I may add about the seriousness of the matter. The elections to the Lok Sabha were fought this year, and in all the States all over the country the election were fought on the issue of democracy and freedom from fear. But if this attitude continues, it means that we have not yet really succeeded to be free from fear. This is serious matter I would like to appeal to the Chair to consider seriously that, at least in our State, let us make a beginning. Let us have the assurance that there should be freedom from fear for all the citizens, not to speak only of Members of this House.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I do not know in what ways the results of the Lok Sabha elections are relevant.

Mr. Speaker :- I think there can be no discussion on that.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I am just making a submission that this is under the Central Act.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Sir, may I point out that this august House also passed a bill allowing us to have telephone and the purpose of giving telephones would be defeated if...

Mr. Speaker :- I have already made my observation that any further discussion on this is closed. But I have made my observation that if there is any specific case of a Member of this august House being disturbed in his regular functioning as a Member that will, of course, come in  a different form.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Before you close this, Sir, and if the House will bear with me, I would like to point out that since no reply can be given as to whether the telephones of the M.L.As have been given as to whether the telephones of the M.L.As have been tapped, it therefore, implies that there may be these who are acting in an anti-national manner. We are supposed to be persons who are upholding the security of the country - we took an oath to uphold the integrity of this country. We do not want names, but we want a categorical assurance for all M.L.As.

Shri. H.E. Pohshna :- Since the hon. Member does not want the names....


Shri. W.A. Sangma, (Chief Minister) :- In the interest of public safety I cannot divulge whether A, B or C's phone is being tapped or not.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- May we know whether the permission of the Union Government or of the Ministry of 
Communication has been taken in this matter ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I have already stated that this Central Act and all these things are done on certain information either from the Central Government or the State Intelligence.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- The second matter on the opening of letters. Here also our correspondence is being opened and the boys doing the opening are not so well-trained because while they re-stick the letter, the seal does not form a perfect circle at the back. We know that they have a steaming machine and that there are some letters which have been copied out. But there is one aspect which seriously affects letters being examined. Why are letters addressed to the Ministers at the Centres or to persons in authority at the Centre, the the Union Government, being systematically opened ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I have no knowledge of that.

Mr. Speaker :- You have already explained that it comes under the same Act.

Shri. H.E. Pohshna :- On a point of information. Whether these letters are closed ?

Mr. Speaker :- I think the hon. member is not supposed to reply. He has asked for information. Prof. M.N. Majaw. To raise a discussion.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, there have been a number of deaths in some parts of this State, particularly in the Ri-Bhoi areas, as a result of bacillary dysentery. We have noticed with satisfaction that whenever an outbreak of epidemics is brought to the notice of the Health Services Directorate and the Civil Surgeon, doctors and nurses are immediately sent to administer, medicines to the sick and dying. As a matter of fact, the total number of persons who died in the last two months is about 35: In the village of Umlaper 17, Mawshang 7, Mawiong 4, Konhadom I, 2, Umtngam - 4, Tyrso, 2, I do not have the figures relating to other parts of the state. I feel that we should have more mobile dispensaries. We would also request the doctors and nurses to stay for a few nights, and not merely ....

Mr. Speaker :- No, you cannot request the doctors and nurses. You can request only the Minister. (Laughter).

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Yes, Sir, through the Minister, so that medical aid, particularly, preventive aid, could be given. The healthy ones, Sir, after the doctors are gone, often fall sick and die of the illness.

Mr. Speaker :- Minister for Health ?

*Shri. Sandford K. Marak (Minister in-charge of Health) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, on receipt of a report of deaths occurring in Umlaper, Umtrai, Mawker, Mawshan and Umsiang on 6thMay 1977 from Shri. B. Pde, Secretary, Umsiang Circle of Ri-Bhoi Area the medica team consisting of Dr. P.B. Marpna, Shri. E. Syiemiong, Para-medical Assistant and Shri. E. Lyngdoh, Rural Health Inspector visited the area along with Shri. Pde. The team visited Umlaper, Umsiang, Umshong Mawker Villages from 8th May, 1977 to 10th May 1977. In all they had treated 274 patients and innoculated T.A. B.C. to 439 persons. There were no cases of enteric dysentery. Most of the cases related to Bacillary dysentery. The team held discussions with the local representatives, whom they had advised to take water after proper treatment. Apart from 11 cases of deaths in Umlaper no other cases were reported to the team. However, the actual cause of death could not be ascertained.

        On receipt of a report from the headman of Umtngam - Tyrso on 24th May 1977 indicating dysentery cases in the area where about 5 persons have died. Dr. P.B. Marpha and Dr. T.K. Bose Roy and two of his staff rushed to the place.

       The team visited Umtngam and Tyrso villages, discussed with the local leaders; examined 422 persons. It was found the majority of the cases belong to Bacillary dysentery. As T.A. B.C. was earlier administered by Bhoilymbong Unit no such inoculation was given. There were after cases of enteric dysentery. The local persons were told to take water after proper treatment.

        On receipt of a letter from the Doctor in-charge Bhoilymbong Dispensary to provide better help to the people of Umtngam, Tyrso and Tjaiong Villages the medical team consisting of Dr. P.B. Marhna (Medical Officer-in-charge of Public Health Duty), Sr. E. Syiemiong Para - Medical Assistant). Shri. E. Lyngdoh (Rural Health Inspector) visited the Umtngam, Tyrso, Mawrathud and Sohphoh Villages on 4th June 1977 and 5th June 1977. The team examined 203 cases. They gave T.A. B.C. inoculation to 239 persons in Tyrso and Umtngam Villages. In the other two villages no T.A.B.C. Inoculation was given as this was report to have been done by the Sisters from Umsohlait Dispensary. Most of the cases were of Bacillary dysentery and there were no cases of enteric dysentery. Excepting 3 cases cause of death could not be ascertained. The local persons were consulted and were advised to use water after treatment.

        The team will go again to Umlaper and Mawiong, Umsiang.

        In response to another report forwarded by Prof. M.N. Majaw dated 2nd June 1977 which was brought by Shri. B. Pde to Civil Surgeon Shillong on 6th June 1977 Dr. P.B. Marpna and Dr. J. Swer of Nayabunglaw proceeded to Umsiang and Mawiong Villages on 7th June 1977 via Umsning Jagi Road but as there was heavy landslide at Korhadem Villages (Umsiangk and Mawiong on 9th June 1977 via Jorabat).

        At Korhadem they treated 22 patients of bacillary dysentery.

        At Maiong Village 12 houses were affected by Bacillary dysentery, 28 people were examined and treated of which 2 are Malaria cases and the rest Bacillary dysentery. Total deaths reported - two (Names of persons in report).

        At Umsiang Village 6 houses were affected and 15 people examined and treated. All cases are Bacillary dysentery. No report of death. In all the villages instructions were given by the doctors regarding use of good drinking water (preferably by boiling) and proper disposal of sewage as the main cause of the disease is attributed to improper disposal of sewage and hygienic drinking water.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- I would like to and here that doctors and nurses who are going as and when there is need to help our people. We have got all praise for them. But I would like to request them to have an operating mobile dispensary, if accepted.

Mr. Speaker :- You cannot request the doctors and nurses; you may request the Minister-in-charge.

Shri. Sandford K. Marak (Minister-in-charge, Health) :- Well we have already tried in Smit and Shella. But since there is no requisite provision of petrol depot we had to stop it. Any way I can assure that we will try to examine the feasibility of mobile dispensary for Umsning - Jagiroad.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Then may I request to give some grants to those charitable dispensaries.

Mr. Speaker :- That is another issue.

Shri. Sandford K. Marak (Minister of Health) :- For the information of the House; we have already given such grants.

Mr. Speaker :- Let us pass on to next item, i.e. Shri. G. Mylliemngap to call the attention of the Chief Minister under Rule 54.

Calling Attention

Shri. G. Mylliemngap :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to call the attention of the Chief Minister under Rule 54 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Meghalaya Legislative Assembly to a new item appearing in the 'Assam Tribune' of 2ndJune 1977, under the caption, '5 killed in trucks accident near Shillong.'

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- A serious motor accident was reported at the Happy Valley Beat House by the driver of MLS - 2048 at 0030 Hrs. (12.30 midnight) on 1st June 1977. The S.I. in-charge of the Happy Valley Beat House left for the place of occurrence shortly after that in a vehicle sent from Shillong Police Station and reached the place of occurrence at 0200 hrs. (2 A.M.) He found truck No. ASU - 383 capised on the road between mile post 8/5 and 8/6. He found four persons lying dead and four other seriously injured. The driver was missing. He sent the four injured persons to the Civil Hospital immediately in the police vehicle taken by him. He held an inquest over the four dead bodies and sent them for post-mortem. One of them was a woman. Of the four injured sent to hospital, one died. Post-mortem on all the 5 dead bodies was done.

        The case was supervised locally by the Deputy Superintendent of Police, (HQRs) and the vehicle was examined by the M.V.I. According to report of the M.V.I. Shillong, the brake, steering, horn and road wheels were in order. The drivers cab was completely damaged and the body of the truck was also damaged. The wind shield glass was out of order. The vehicle was not in a position for a road test as it had capsized in the main road. A case No. 6(6) 77 under section 279/337/338/304(A) I.P.C has been registered and is being investigated. The driver of the vehicle, Shri. Binda Giri, son of Ramayan Giri of Taxpur, Phulparia, P.S. Majai, Chappra (Bihar) who absconded after the accident, surrendered on 3rd June 1977 to the Police. He was arrested and forwarded into custody. The vehicle belonged to , Speedway, India, Gauhati and was proceeding to Tripura with a load of iron pipes. It was raining when the accident occurred.

        The driver's licence and all documents of the vehicles were valid. The vehicle was issued permit by the S.T.A., Assam, on Gauhati Agartala Road which is valid upto 24th June 1977 countersigned by the S.T.A. Meghalaya on reciprocal basis, so payment of corridor fee does not arise.

        Under Rule 105 of the Assam Motor Vehicle Rules, 1940 as adopted in Meghalaya, no passenger is allowed to travel in the Public carries.

        Persons found dead at the place of occurrence :-

        1. U Kiston Kharkongor,    

        2. Ka Thret Nongkhlaw,

        3. U Kornoshon Kharkongor,

        4. U Rolip Wankhar.

        Persons who died at Shillong Civil Hospital :-

        1. U Sher Kharkongor.

        2. Shri. Nripen Ranjan Nath.

        3. One person probably handy-man of the truck (found unconscious).

Shri. G. Mylliemngap :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, on a point of information, whether the Government is thinking to provide some relief to the family members of the deceased persons ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Well, the Government will consider this matter but I don't know whether the Government is held responsible or somebody else. You see in such cases the matter is referred to the appropriate authority first.


Mr. Speaker :- Yes actually this matter cannot be decided at present. Let this case be referred to the Government first then only consideration of this case will arise.

        So, before we pass on to next item, I have the announcement to make. I am to inform the House that eight (8) valid nomination were received in favour of the following 5 (five) Members to constitute the Committee on public Accounts for the term beginning from 7th July, 1977 -

1. Shri. Stalington David Kharkongor.

2. Md. Akrammozzaman.

3. Shri. S. Phaindrojen Swer.

4. Shri. Onward Leyswell Nongtdu.

5. Shri. Pleander G. Momin.

        Since the number of candidates is equal to the number of seats to be filled, all the 5 (five) Members have been declared elected to the Committee on Public Accounts.

        Under Sub-Rule (1) of the Rule 198 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Assembly, I appoint Shri. S. Phaindrojen Swer as the Chairman of the Committee.

        Then regarding the next announcement I am to inform the House that 11 (eleven) valid nominations were received in favour of the following 8 (eight) Members to constitute the Committee on Estimates for the term beginning 7th July, 1977 -

1. Shri. Plansing Marak.

2. Shri. Winstone Syiemiong.

3. Shri. Alexander Warjri.

4. Shri. Jackman Marak.

5. Shri. Dhrubanath Joshi.

6., Shri. Edward Kurbah.

7. Shri. H.E. Pohshna.

8. Mrs. Miriam D. Shira.

        Shri Enowell Pohshna, however subsequently withdrew his candidature, leaving only 7 candidates in the field.  

        Since the number of remaining candidates is equal to the number of seats to be filled, all the 7 (seven) Members, namely, Shri. Plansing Marak, Shri. Winstone Syiemiong, Alexander Warjri, Shri. Jackman Marak, Shri. Dhrubanath Joshi, Shri. Edward Kurbah and Mrs. Miriam D. Shira have been elected declared to Committee on Estimates.

        Under Sub-Rule (1) of Rule 198 of the Rules of Procedure and Conduct of Business in the Assembly, I appoint Shri. Plansing Marak as the Chairman.

        Now may I call upon Shri. Maham Singh. Minister-in-charge of Revenue to make a statement

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister revenue) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, yesterday while answering to supplementary question to unstarred question No. 73 (d). I had mentioned that the fee for application for sanction of the transfer of land is a fixed fee of Rs.250. On verification, it has been found that Rs.250/- is the maximum fee and the rate varies according to the nature of transfer namely :

(a) Five per cent of the sale price in case of a sale.

(b) Two and half per cent of the value of the property as may be valued by the competent authority in case of a gift. The valuation of the property shall be based on the current market value of the property taking into consideration.

(c) Five per cent of the consideration money in the case of lease.

(d) Rs.1 per hundred in the case of mortgage, provided that the fee payable under items (a), (b), (c) and (d) shall not exceed Rs.250 (Rupees two hundred fifty).

(e) Rupees one hundred in case of other transfer.

Mr. Speaker :- Sir, I regret very much for the mistake.

Shri. Jormanik Syiem :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, may we know from the Minister to whom such fees are paid whether to the Government or to the District Council ?

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Sir, such fees are paid to the competent authority  i.e. to the District Council ?

Shri. Jormanik Syiem :- Sir, to whom such fees are credited ?

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Sir, I want notice for that.

Shri. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, on the point of clarification, I would like to know whether it is the District Council or the C.E.M. who is the competent authority ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- It is the C.E.M.

Shri. M.N. Majaw :- Then Sir, such fees are credited to the accounts of the three C.E.Ms of our State by themselves instead of crediting it to the accounts of the State Government because it has not been shown in the receipt of the revenue collection.

Mr. Speaker :- I think I will only request the Minister to examine the implication of the Act because the Minister has made the statement only to correct the wrong information which he presented on the floor of this House yesterday. So, to get the information as to who is the competent authority and to which account this fee is credited is a matter to be examined by the Minister concerned and do the needful accordingly.

        Now, let us pass on to the next item. Now, Mr. S.P. Swer to move that Meghalaya Transfer of Land Regulation (Amendment) Bill, 1977 be taken into consideration.

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to .....................

Mr. Speaker :- No, no, he has not moved.

Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Mr. speaker, Sir, I want to oppose the motion ...............

Mr. Speaker :- I told you that he has not moved his motion.

Shri. S.P. Swer :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the Meghalaya Transfer of Land (Regulation) (Amendment) Bill, 1977 be taken into consideration.

Mr. Speaker :- Now, since he has moved the motion, the Minister can oppose the motion.

*Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I want to oppose the motion because I oppose the very principle of the Bill itself. In this connection, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would submit that the spirit of the Bill is against the very policy that has been followed by Government.

        Now, Mr. Speaker, Sir, in this connection it may be mentioned that all along the Government has been diligently following the policy of having a clean, active and efficient administration. So, in all cases we want a quick disposal of cases but in this Bill, I would submit that it leaves room for slackness in administration. They want to eliminate altogether the time for giving reply to all applications for transfer of land. Now what is the statement of object and reasons that has mentioned in the Bill brought forward by the hon. Member. He says that according to sub-section (3) of Section 4 of the Meghalaya Transfer of Land (Regulation) Act, 1971 (Act of 1972) prescribing a time limit for disposal of land transfer applications is not necessary or desirable as it entails administrative difficulties. Now the question is of administrative difficulty. In fact we want that the administration should serve the people. We want the public at least to be free from the harassment of having to go and attending the office of and on. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the applicants would naturally like want to know definitely within a specific period of time, what actually has happened to the application that has been submitted by them to the authorities concerned. Now in this connection I would also, submit that, this is a business transaction between a tribal and non-tribal. If a tribal wants to sell away his land to a non-tribal he has to obtain the permission from some authority. Mr. Speaker, Sir, a tribal want to sell his land because he is in distress and he is in difficulty. It is only under hard conditions that he wants to sell away his land. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would submit that under these conditions to sell his land there is another from a non-tribal. An application is made. It cannot be kept in suspense from an indefinite period of time. Now in all cases I have found that when a person has got a right to do a thing but has got to get some permission for the enforcement of his right, by having to apply to some authority that is, for carrying out a right which he has got a time limit has always been fixed for the reply that should be given to the application. In the other Acts what do we find ? In the Municipal Act only a period of 30 days is given for the Municipality to dispose of cases and give a definite reply whether they agree to the application that has been filed by a person who wants to erect a building or not. Now Section 171 of the Assam Municipal Act says : 'No person shall erect, materially alter, or re-erect, or commence to erect, materially alter or re-erect any building without sanction of the Board. Then again we find in Section 174 (1) which says 'within one month after the receipt of the notice required by Section 171, sub-section (2) or clause (iii) of Section 302, the Board may refuse to sanction the building or any sanction it either absolutely or subject to such modification as it may deem fit in respect of all or any of the matters specified in Section 302 clause (iv); and the person erecting, materially altering or re-erecting any such building as aforesaid shall comply with the sanction of the Board as granted in every particular.

        (1) Should the Board neglect or omit for one month after receipt of a valid notice to make and deliver to the person who has given such notice an order of sanction or refusal in respect thereof, it shall be deemed to have sanctioned the proposed building absolutely. Now, Mr. Speaker, Sir when we compare the two bodies we find that the competent authority in the land transfer regulation is the District Council which is a constitutionally elected body. What is expected Mr. Speaker, Sir, is that the District Council should act more efficiently.

Mr. Speaker :- I think you are going to open the question raised by Mr. M.N. Majaw, whether the C.E.M is defined as the competent authority.

*Shri. Maham Singh (Minister, Revenue) :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is the Chief Executive Member in his official capacity. So Mr. Speaker, Sir, we find also in other Acts provisions relating to transfer of land. We find also in Urban land Ceiling and Regulation Acts and Rules that a time limit has been prescribed for a reply to be given. In Section 27 of the Prohibition on transfer of urban property we find that a person is not allowed to transfer the property. The relevant section says 'Notwithstanding anything contained in any other law for the time being in force but subject to the provisions of sub-section (3) of Section 5 and sub-section (4) of Section 10, no person shall transfer by way of sale, mortgage, give lease for a period exceeding ten years, or otherwise any urban or, unbanizable land with a building (whether constructed before or after the commencement of this Act) or a portion only of such building for a period of ten years of such commencement or from the date on which the building is constructed, whichever is later, except with the previous permission in writing of the competent authority.

        (2) Any person desiring to make a transfer referred to in sub-section (1), may make an application in writing to competent authority in such from and in such manner as may be prescribed.

        (3) On receipt of an application under sub-section (2), the competent authority may, after making such inquiry as it deems fit by order in writing, grant or refuse to grant the permission applied for. So, we find that there is a time prescribed within which the competent authority should give the reply and we find this also in the Land Transfer Act where a period is much longer. So if we do not fix any period whatsoever for a reply then what will happen. We will find that there will be a great deal of harassment to both the transfer of land and transferee in the sense that they will have to attend for days together the office of the competent authority to find out what is the fate of their application. Mr. Speaker, Sir, if a date is not fixed on a prescribed time limit is not put for a reply it will be very unjust and very unreasonable. So with these few words I even oppose the consideration of this Bill because as I have stated it is against the very principle itself against the very policy that the Government is following a policy, have an effective and clean administration and quick disposal of cases.

Shri. S.P. Swer :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to submit that the objective in view in bringing in this Bill before the House is that to do away with the rides prescribed time limit. The object of Land Transfer Act 1971 is to protect the tribals from any exploitation of the rich and advanced non-tribals who can really exploit the tribals and deprive them of their land. When this Act was administered by the competent authorities, we cannot be blind, as elected representatives of the people, to how far the effectiveness of this Act is being administered and also we may recall that prior to the existence of this Act, there was the Land Transfer Act of the District Councils which is in the same line and in the same spirit. But there was no prescribed time limit in that Act. When that Act was in operation, the Commission on the Hills Areas of Assam in its report of 1965-66 under the chairmanship of Shri. H.V. Pataskar duly recommended the restrictions under that Act as administered by the District Council. And the Commission report read like this "there is no evidence to show that the District Councils have administered the restrictions on non-tribals in acquiring and disposing of land in an arbitrary or unreasonable manner". Therefore, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not se that the fear or the harassment will be meted out to the people applying for transfer of land will be there from the authorities concerned who administered the Act. This is the transfer of land which is quite different from that of sanction for construction of a building in the Municipal area for disposal of transfer of urban properties. But this is the question of transfer of land. The very purpose of this Act is to protect land from passing away into the hands of land grabbing, rich and advanced people. The purpose of the Act is to protect the poor tribal people. Here, Mr. Speaker, Sir, the period of the prescribed time limit as prescribed the Act is not necessary in view of the performance in the past years with the erstwhile Land Transfer Act of the District Council. In the Act itself, the formalities to be complied with while processing such applications to accord sanction is a long process and time consuming. to come to any correct and genuine decision, the competent authority is to satisfy itself that all the formalities are enquired into and are found satisfactory or otherwise. But we cannot be blind to it that during the process the period of six months and because of this prescribed time limit, a decision has to be made whether right or wrong and if not, sub-section (4) of Section 4 of the Act will automatically bestow the applicant the sanction or will automatically accord sanction even in the absence of any executive order from the competent authority. Therefore, it is found that it defeats the very purpose of he Act. Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Government should be aware of what he competent authorities have had occasion to express their difficulties I processing the applications for land transfer long time back, and subject to correction, the C.E.Ms of the District Councils have had occasion to express this difficulty of processing applications because of the prescribed time limit to the then Law and Revenue Minster some time on 31st January, 1976. They have clearly expressed that this rider prescribed time limit should be done away with. Therefore, Sir, I beg to submit that for all practical purposes, with the passing of time, the work also increased and so it calls upon the competent authority to  gear up the machinery otherwise they very purpose of the Act will be defeated just because of this, it will entail a great financial difficulty to the competent authorities. Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not go by the lapses on the part of the competent authorities but I go by the spirit and letter of the Act and this Bill is being brought based on the actual practices, actual performance, and I hope that the fear which was expressed by the Hon'ble Minister for Law will not be there because we have seen the erstwhile Land Transfer Act of the District Council was administered in a reasonable manner in all cases of transfer of land. With these few words, I beg to submit that the Bill be taken into consideration.

*Shri. Brington B. Lyngdoh :- Just on a point of information Mr. Speaker, Sir, hon. Member has referred to the meeting held on 31st January 1976. Indeed there was a meeting of all the C.E.Ms and E.Ms. of the District Councils and their officers with the Government on the 31st January and from the Governments side there the officers of Revenue Department and also the Minister of Education, the Revenue Minister and myself. In the proceedings which were circulated to all the members attending the meeting and also to all the officers of various Departments, there was a statement made by the competent authority that it is true and the District Council also said it is true and those who are familiar with the Pataskar Commission Report for the administration of the Land Transfer Act, 1963 of the District Council were examined thoroughly by that Pataskar Commission in 1965-66 and nothing was found by the Commission against the provision of the Land Transfer Regulation Act of the District Council for those period even without this ride. This is a matter of information in the light of what we have discussed during the Budget Session that there is nothing static in a State or society or Community and in the light of experience of lands for nearly six years now, there should be no obstinate sticking to any modification, changes and adaptation in the light of experience of the two competent authorities of the East Khasi Hills and West Khasi Hills and Jaintia Hills Districts. They have expressed their experiences and the Government really did consider and the House also might consider in the light of these experiences. That is all I have to speak on this.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- The hon. Member has said that the Government might consider his amendment, I would like to clarify certain basic points which have to be considered in this regard lest the Government may be misunderstood. No.1 we want to restrict the transfer of land from the tribals to the non-tribals and also from the non-tribals to the non-tribals. Now once the object of the Regulation is accepted we have to follow certain procedure of disposal and we have also to consider, the reasonableness of the transaction under this Act. No.2. Let us bear in mind that the tribal will never think of disposal of his land unless and until he is compelled by circumstances to do so. For the tribal there is nothing else except the land he possesses. Let us be very clear about it that when circumstances compel a tribal to dispose of this land, we must try to prescribe a procedure which will not result in unnecessary and undue hardship to a particular tribal. Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the Principal Act, we have laid down the conditions under what circumstances a non-tribal will be allowed to buy land from a tribal. This was considered by the hon. friend from Nongthymmai with whom he had drafted the Bill together to make it reasonable under Article 19, clause (5).

        We thought we should make out certain terms and conditions to this effect :

(1) Whether non-tribals hold any other land in Meghalaya;

(2) Whether there are other tribals willing to take the land on transfer at the market value ?

(3) Whether non-tribals seeking to take the land on transfer are carrying on any business, profession or vocation in or near the area and whether for the purposes of such business, profession or vocation, it is necessary for him to reside in the area ?

(4) Whether the proposed transfer is likely to promote the economic interests of the Scheduled Tribes in the area ?

        Now these areas are to be processed before finalising an application by the competent authority.

Mr. Speaker :- Actually the hon. Member from this side has not objected to these but, stated about the difficulties of the competent authority to examine the case within a short period.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I think for going through all the investigations six months time is quite adequate.

        I am trying to find out in consultation with the District Council if it may be possible for us to appoint an enforcement agency. But I think a tribal who is really in need of disposing of his land will suffer greater hardship if there is no time limit. If we can not get a fellow tribal to purchase land then the Government comes up with a proposal to acquire the land or find a purchaser to help the tribal who has to dispose of his land. We all agree that there should be protection of the tribal as far as land is concerned. There are no two opinions about it. The only difference in opinion before the House is this, whether there should be a time limit for disposal or not. A reference was made to the Pataskar Commission's Report. I know about it and that was because of the complaint against the delay in the disposal of such cases. Records were examined and it was found that there was no undue delay. Quite true, but one should remember that even in the bigger administrative set-up not to speak of District Council, unless and until a responsible officer who is supposed to dispose of the case before him is given some sort of direction that this must be done today there would be delay. If you simply give me time we will do it whether in 1 or 2 or 3 years. We want preservation of the tribals and at the same time we want to find out ways and means to help the tribals as much as possible. Therefore, based on past experiences we find six months time is quite adequate.

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- Whose experience ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma :- As Chief Executive Member.

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- Experience of the competent authority ?

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Yes.

        While we are pressing to remove the time limit as we know that it is for the interest of the tribal for the disposal of the case on land transfer we are of the opinion that six months time is quite adequate. It will not help only the purchaser but it will help also our own poor tribal man who is being compelled by circumstance to dispose of his land.

Mr. Speaker :- The motion was moved that the Bill be taken into consideration, and if I allow each and every Member, to speak then it will appear as it is has already been taken into consideration. I think there is more scope for this matter on some other occasions. So I put the question before the House. The question is that the Meghalaya Transfer of Land Regulation (Amendment) Bill 1977 be taken into consideration.

(The motion was negatived)

        Item No.4. Mr. B.B. Lyngdoh to continue his discussion on Motion No.1


*Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- Mr. Speaker, Sir, on the date fixed for discussion of this motion I have referred to the programmes of the Maharashtra Government with reference to the protection and development of the tribal people in that State. I would refer to one item of the  programme that is in the matter of protection from exploitation of the tribal people in the tribal areas of Maharashtra with respect of trade by businessmen or business by the advanced rich people from the plains. The Maharashtra Government has taken steps to establish state trading in the tribal areas to protect the tribal people from being exploited by the rich advanced people from the plains. Here Sir, last year our Government has also considered on those lines. We have decided to start and open trade centres in the tribal areas through co-operative societies in order to protect the tribal interest in business in the tribal areas. My only suggestion in this respect is only that the Government may quickly implement the schemes to establish trade centres in tribal areas through co-operatives and also to watch that there may be areas in which these cooperative schemes may not work. Then the Government may consider like the one that was taken by the Maharashtra State. Trading and that will safeguard the interest of the tribal people here from exploitation by the traders of the rich advanced people from the plains.

        We have in the Sixth Schedule the provision for the District Council to give licenses to non-tribals for opening up business and trade in the tribal areas. It was in operation in 1953 onwards. But the experience of all the hon. Members in this August House shows that the provision in the Sixth Schedule had not been affective and that the non-tribals are competent to do business here, people from the plains entered into all the nook and corner of the State. Sir, in the concerned Assembly it was considered to have such an attitude that the District Council composed of the tribal themselves will protect the tribal people from exploitation by advanced rich businessmen from the plain by the licencing authorities and in the last 30 years or so it has not found to be adequate in spite of the regulation we will find in all nook and corner, in remote areas of Meghalaya, the non-tribals have taken up business. Perhaps only one village is a notable exception and that is Mairang village, by certain circumstances, we do not have any non-tribals business men here in the biggest market in Khasi Hills. The Langstieh Bazar has been free from non-tribal people. But these are very rare exceptions. In Garo Hills also the business is in the hands of the non-tribals and the experience we have had during the last few days is that tezpata trading in our border area, Dawki, is being monopolised by one non-tribal businessmen and he has exploited the people. The people from that area came to me and they complained about this I wrote to the Sirdar to get a copy of the complaint so that I will refer the matter to the District Council or the Syiem of Khyrim. But such war the power of this non-tribal businessman that the Sirdar even was afraid to give the copy. From experience I always have in so far as such things are concerned is because there is no hard and fast programme that we have adopted in the light of the experience that we get in the course of implementation  of this Schedule. So here, if three lakhs of tribals in Maharashtra are being protected by the State Government, in the implementation of this trading scheme of the Government, I would suggest that Government would implement quickly and caution whether it will be implemented or not in so far as protection of the tribal from exploitation in trade is concerned and since I have discussed very thoroughly in the budget speech regarding this matter, I simply want through this motion to bring out this very particular consideration and suggestion. I now resume my seat.

        (At this stage, the Speaker left the Chamber and Shri. Plansing Marak, Chairman took the Chair).

*Shri. Humphrey Hadem :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, I associate myself with this particular motion. But I shall be very brief and concise and I will speak of the principles of the purpose of the motion. Our people, Mr. Chairman, Sir, is fighting for a separate State, did so at least to preserve our own identity in this part of the country and secondly to develop ourselves and grow in our own genius. Sir, if my memory does not fail me, the then Prime Minister in her speech during the inauguration of this State uttered and promised the same privileges that our people will get in this State. But Sir, from experience during this present term of the life of this Assembly it has proved otherwise. Now, Sir, let us take two or three instances only. I mean first let us come to the administrative side of the question. From some reason may be, the officers have been brought from outside on the plea that our people are not yet capable enough. Schemes have to be prepared  in line with all India basic. In any post is to be created either  in connection with the administration on any post is to be created either in connection with the administration on with the development activities of the State, we have to enquire what is the position or what steps have been taken by the other States in such particular cases. So, in short, everything is only a copy of what other States have done or let me put it in other words, ours is but a carbon copy of others. The outcome, therefore, Sir, is when the head of the department is from any part of the country, the staff automatically or naturally  will be named from top to the lowest rank by the personnel belonging to that part of the country or even let me emphasise, even for the post of Chaprashi of that department. But the House knows very well about the circumstances. We were discussing since yesterday about family planning and others, expressing our fears that our tribal identity will perhaps be wiped out in the near future. But Sir, it will be more either this way or that way. I will leave it to the House to decided. It is good that we should have our own identity. But where are the principles of preservation of that identity? That is the question to be examined carefully and it is also in the context that we have to follow a policy of others States for administration and developmental purposes. Sir, may I point out that this will not have a mandatory effect on the State. Otherwise, what is that tribal identity, what are its principles if we do not know how to preserve it according to our genius. I am afraid that the present process will have a far-reaching affect on the principles of our State. It means to be as it will go either this or that way. Neither we have to go according to our own genius nor we have to adopt ourselves, it seems to be an adulterated one. So Sir, I have many concrete instances to point out in this particular aspect of protection and development of our State. Protection of the tribal people of this State. But Sir, I think I shall not at this stage enumerate each and everything. Sir, I would suggest that in order to achieve the objective, as I have stated since the formation of this State, I think, right from the inception of an autonomous State and nearly six years now, we have to think and consider it seriously. It is high time that we should get our own people trained as officers in all spheres of Government activities so that we can preserve our identity. This is my contention, Sir. And only then we can preserve our own identity according to our own genius. The protection and development of our State will come only from this. I will make it very clear, because it is only he who wears the shoes knows where the shoe pinches. We can not go this or that way. With these few words, Sir, I resume my seat.

Shri. M. Reidson Momin :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, this motion is very important and although many of my friends have participated in the discussion. I will be failing in my duty as a representative of the people if I do not speak a few words on this motion. Sir, many of the hon. Members have apprehended that measures for protection and development of tribal people are not sufficient. But Sir, I think we have a number of measures, number of actions if we actually follow in the true spirit and in right earnest. For example, Sir, we have on employment 80 per cent reservation for tribal people. Sometimes, I find that even we are not in a position or rather the Government is not in a position to fill up even this 80 per cent. So I think this provision or this reservation of 80 per cent for employment for our boys and girls is quite sufficient. Then again in looking after the interest of our contractors we have given 7 per cent discount for our petty contractors, for our tribal contractors. So Mr. Chairman, Sir, to mention a few, we have certain measures or power vested in the District Councils under the Sixth Schedule of the Constitution for checking the influx of outsiders into our State. They again regarding transfer of land also, we have the powers delegated to the District Council to have those powers exercised properly by the respective District Councils. I think there is no fear of exploitation of our tribal people by the outsiders. Today, our main concern in this motion is about the sale of land from a tribal to a non-tribal as we have already discussed and many hon. Members have also spoken that the District Councils have full power to have control over the sale of land from a tribal to a non-tribal or by a non-tribal to a non-tribal. However, I will come back to this latter on and thus, I would like to deal with the problems which I have enumerated regarding employment. As I said, Sir, everyone of us in this August House, know that the 80 percent reservation for our tribal boys and girls is there I speak subject to correction. Mr. Chairman, Sir, so even then, as I have said the Government is finding difficulties to get proper and suitable candidates for certain categories of employment from among our boys and girls. Naturally, we cannot allow the Departments to be without employees or without management and so we have to recruit from the open market or from among outsiders, that is to say, from among the non-tribals.

        On another point, Sir, it has been my or rather our experience that when a tribal boy is appointed a vacancy either at Tura or Shillong whether a boy or girl - he/she will not come by saying that Shillong is too cold. Again, a boy or a girl from here will rather not go to Tura by saying that Tura is too hot or that there is not accommodation. If somebody is appointed for a post at Williamnagar he will say: I will not go there. There is no good society. These, Sir, are the difficulties. It is not that we should blame only the Government but we should also blame our own people. Mr. Chairman, Sir, we should know that we have achieved this State of our own through hard struggle for a number of years. Many of us have contributed our little mite to achieve this political goal. After achieving Statehood for almost 7 years of running 7th year, we are the pioneers of our State and unless we undertake certain difficulties and certain sacrifices then we shall not be able to build up a strong and beautiful and comfortable State of our own. We shall have to sacrifice for the good of our future generation. Unless we are ready to go to Williamnagar today, Williamnagar will not develop and there would be no use having administrative units although it has been the intention of the Government to bring the administration nearer to the people. That will not come if we are trying to put the blame on the Government. We have to share the blame or blame ourselves. Then again, Mr. Chairman, Sir, we should also remember that ours is a secular State. Today, the Leader of the House has had the opportunity to make a statement that this State had been achieved through the well wishes and also help of friends from other States not only by our own efforts. Now that we have achieved this goal, if we say that we want to live only among ourselves is bad. To me, at least, it is bad. We should not be so selfish. We have enough scope and avenues to improve ourselves and until we work side by side along with the non-tribals, we shall not be able to learn. We are still at the learning stage. So Mr. Chairman, Sir, we cannot say that the non-tribals should not be entertained in our State of Meghalaya.

        Mr. Chairman, Sir, I come back to the point on contractors, I am indeed grateful to the Government that a discount has been given to our petty contractors so that they can take up works for small amounts. But Mr. Chairman, Sir, here I must also point out that although this 7 per cent is restricted to the amount of work below Rupees fifty thousand, I would like to say that there is a tendency in the P.W.D. to make a group of works in such a way that the amount is beyond Rupees fifty thousand and so the scope for this provision is thereby rendered null and void or does not become applicable once it is above Rupees fifty thousand. On the other hand, I do not intend to blame the engineers or authorities in the P.W.D. because in the case of certain works like R.C.C. Bridges or R.C.C. buildings, of course, the amount would exceed Rupees fifty thousand and our tribal contractors cannot undertake. But what I want to say is that in the case of earth work this can always be given to the small contractors and for which the amount would around 20, 25, or even 5 thousand rupees.

        Lastly, Mr. Chairman, Sir, I would say that although there are protection measures to protect the interest of the tribals, there is much scope still. We particularly need sincere and honest officers as Government agents, whether here in Shillong, Tura or Williamnagar, Baghmara, Nongstoin or Jowai. Mr. Chairman, Sir, until and unless whether a tribal or non-tribal, we feel as Meghalayan and work for the people and in which we earn our bread, and unless that spirit is there it is not possible. If I think I am not a tribal I should not be so sincere or honest since I am working under Meghalaya when actually I belong to Assam or Bengal or Maharashtra. Then Sir, no matter what amount of measures the Government proposes to undertake or adopt, such measures will never work. With these few words, I would request the Government and the officers through you, Sir, to have more co-operation with the public and to look after the interest of our tribal people in a better way.

Mr. Chairman :- I think there is no other discussion. I would request the Minister-in-charge of Planning to reply.

        (A voice - The Minister is not in the House)

Shri. K.M. Roy Marbaniang :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, let us take up some other business. What a strange thing the Minister is absent.

(The Hon'ble Chief Minister entered the Chamber)

Mr. Chairman :- I will now request the Minister-in-charge to reply to the discussion.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, I am indeed very grateful to the hon. Member from Mawlai who has brought this motion. It is a very important motion and we are all concerned about it and it is the primary duty not only of the Government alone but also all of us to see that interests of our tribal people are protected. In doing so it is not for any other reason but in view of the fact that even the framer of the Constitution have recognised the need for protection of the weaker sections of the people from all sort of exploitation. The mover of the motion on the basis of some talk among the people, stated that according to the people the Chief Minister of the State of Meghalaya is anti-tribal nor am I anti non-tribal. It is my duty as Chief Minister of the State to look after the interests of all sections of the people. But in doing so under the directive principles, if I am correct, under Article 46, it is the duty of the State to promote with special care the educational and economic interests of the weaker sections of the people, and in particular, of the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes, and to protect them from social injustice and from all forms of exploitation. Therefore, Mr. Chairman, Sir, you will kindly appreciate that as a Chief Minister of the State it is my duty and it is my obligation to promote the interest of the Scheduled tribes, Scheduled Castes and other weaker section of the people residing in the State of Meghalaya. I would not have given reply to this, Mr. Chairman, Sir, but I know my colleague in the opposite who once had the occasion to work with me must have known my attitude, my anxiety in trying to initiate various measures for the protection of our tribal brothers and sisters of the State. A doubt was expressed by the hon. Member from Jaiaw while admitting that he had the occasion to work with me and had seen hat I took great interest in the protection of the tribals, that there might have been change of attitude after becoming a Congress Chief Minister. My reply to that is in the negative. 

        In this connection, Mr. Chairman, Sir, I would like to remind the hon. Members that it is the Congress, through the Constituent Assembly, has brought all these provisions under the Constitution. Therefore, there should not be any doubt about it. The Constituent Assembly was composed of Congress leaders in the majority and all these provisions had been provided at the instance of that great Organisation. Therefore, there should be no scope to doubt that the changed Government will take a different attitude.    

(A voice : There has been a change)

        No. I must be very clear that there is no change of the policy which we have adopted. I would like to hear if anybody can cite a single example which can be taken as change of policy after the Congress has taken over the administration. The Policy which we jointly followed, the plans and programmes which we have decided together are being implemented. Mr. Chairman, Sir, the motion reads like this - this House do now discuss about the measures for the protection and development of the tribal people of the State. We had occasion, Mr. Chairman, Sir, while we were together to discuss various measures which  may help to preserve our socials cultural and customary identity. And we have not charged the measures which we adopted together to protect our social, cultural and customary identity. But sometimes in spite of our best efforts we land in difficulties. Sir, mention was made about the Residential Permit Bill which was passed by this House. My colleague, the hon. Member from Nongthymmai know well about the various difficulties which came to our way and because of which we could not get the assent of the President. Sir, even though we failed to get the assent of the President, we had the occasion to sit together to see whether any other alternative measures could be taken for the protection of the tribals specially for maintaining the population structure of the tribal people. Mr. Chairman, Sir, may I take this opportunity to remind my colleague what was the actual difficulty for not getting the assent of the President on this Bill. Sir, we tried to bring this Bill on the social and economic interest of the tribals, but it was pointed out that the Bill relates to the Inter-State Migration, which is a Central subject. In view of that the Bill could not be passed. Otherwise, I would have taken up this matter with the Government of India to see whether some reasonable restrictions can be made through proper legislation. As you know, Mr. Chairman, Sir, under Article 19 of the Constitution of India, regarding the fundamental rights of the citizen, it is stated that all the citizens shall have (a) the right to freedom of speech and expression, (b) to settle down peacefully and then (c) to form an association and (d) to move freely throughout the territory of India, and (e) to settle down in any part of the Indian territory. I will read again, (d) to move freely throughout the Indian territory of India, (e) to reside and settle in any part of the territory of India (f) to acquire, hold and dispose of property, (g) to start any profession or to carry on any trade or business. But Clause empowers the State Government for having certain restrictions on these rights, i.e., on (d), (e) and (f) and according to sub-Clause (d) (e), and (f) of the said Clause, shall affect the operation of any distinct law in so far as it imposes or prevents the States from making any law for imposing reasonable restrictions on the misuse of the rights conferred by the said Sub-Clause - either in the interest of the general public or for the protection of the interest of any tribe. We thought, Mr. Chairman, Sir, that under this Clause the State Government was competent to bring a legislation. But we were told that this relates to Inter-State migration and it is outside the purview of State legislation. While the Government of India decided to bring certain amendments to the Constitution of India, again we thought that some special provisions should be incorporated, as Under Article 371 (g), similar to that of Nagaland and some other States and then to jointly represent our grievances in a group. But Sir, the initial reaction of this particular matter was then when this matter was processed by the Ministry of Home Affairs, they came to the conclusion that such a similar provision would not be necessary in view of the provision of the Sixth Schedule. This is not my view. Mr. Chairman, Sir, it is the view of the Government of India. Then in this connection, I would like to draw the attention of the hon. Member through you, that Nagaland from the very beginning refused to accept the provisions of the Sixth Schedule because they wanted to be outside the Indian Union. Therefore, the Nagaland problem is a political problem and it is not a law and order problem. They are trying to find out what measures should be brought forward to make the Naga people realise that their interests relating to the social and customary practices and usages will be properly safeguarded. That is why Article 371 (a) had been incorporated in the Constitution of India. It is a fact that certain legislative powers have been made to the respective Autonomous District Councils under the provisions of Sixth Schedule and we also know to what extent these provisions can be of help to protect the interest of the tribals and then it was agreed that  Paragraph 12A should be suitable amended so that instead of the President, under Clause (b), the Governor may have the power to see that a particular Act of Parliament should be applicable or not. As a reference I would like to read this. The President may, with respect to any Act of Parliament by notification direct that it shall not apply to any Autonomous District or autonomous region in the State of Meghalaya or apply to such district or region or any part thereof subject to such exceptions or modifications as he may specify by a notification to make it applicable to our State'. Mr. Chairman, Sir, the President  means the Government of India. So we wanted this to be revised by the Governor which means the legislature of the State of Meghalaya. This also has been agreed to. I do not know whether the present Government will be agreeable to carry out the commitment by the previous Government. From all this Sir, it will be clear, as somebody said that I am not anti-tribal. It is indeed unfortunate that people sometimes make loose talk without knowing what is being done by the Government under my leadership. However, Mr. Chairman, Sir, I welcome the suggestion that outside this House, instead of trying to find out the faults of the shortcomings in the implementation of the various measures which have been taken by the Government for the protection of the tribal population it will be more effective for the State if we can meet in a round-table Conference to give our proposals.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah:- So you accept my suggestion.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I accepted and we will take the earliest opportunities to discuss this matter  fully. But in this connection, I had one submission to make. From the discussion it appears to me that we have expressed our concern about our tribal brothers and sisters by repeating what measures have been initiated by the Government. But nobody come forward with further suggestion as to what additional measures should be taken. In this connection it may be replied to the hon. Member from Nongthymmai that I have suggested that we should follow up the programme taken up for the development and protection of the tribals in Maharashtra. Sir, may I, in this connection submit that the entire plan of Meghalaya is meant for the tribals in view of the fact that 80 per cent of the population is composed of the tribals and we are not provided with any amount under that tribal development plan. I try my best to get a share under that particular scheme, but it was argued that since more than 80 per cent of the population is composed of the tribals the entire plan is a tribal plan. Therefore I do not know whether it is possible to follow a scheme or programme which is being taken up by the Maharashtra Government for the protection of the tribals and for their rapid development.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- But you can provide from our own State exchequer.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- But Mr. Chairman, Sir, that would depend on the nature of the scheme. So I would like to submit that whatever schemes we take up they are meant for the benefit of the population of the State as a whole. Now while it is meant for the entire State, since the tribal population constitutes 80 percent the major share goes to them, whether it will be one or two special schemes at the State level. Whatever it is, there is a scope to discuss together as to the further measures, legislative or otherwise or in the sphere of developmental activities which can be taken up for the protection of the interests of the tribals and for expeditious development and improvement of the tribal people. So I am prepared to accept the suggestion. Mr. Chairman, Sir, a doubt has been expressed through discussions and through questions, that in the matter of employment also we are not giving adequate attention to the children of the soil. I tried to collect the figures which speak for themselves. Of course these relate to Secretariat and Heads of Departments. At present in both the wings, viz. the Secretariat and Directorates we have 2,464 employees. As against this number the tribal employees are 2,164 and non tribals 300. So , the tribal employees constitute 80 percent and non-tribals 12 percent approximately.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- I think this does not include Gr. IV employees.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- It includes Gr. IV employees also. In the Secretariat the non-tribals 88 and tribals 854. The total comes to 942. In the heads of departments the tribals are 1310 and non-tribals 212. The total comes to 1,522. So the total number of employees both tribals and non-tribals, is 2,464 of which are tribals 2164 and non-tribals 300. In this, I do not want to take the credit myself. It was a joint effort of my friends in the opposition. But I would like to say here that I have not changed my attitude after I became the Congress Chief Minister. None of us has changed. In fact, we are following the same policy laid down by all of us. I can assure you that we will follow the same policy and that is a policy consistent with the Congress Policy to protect the interest of the tribal people. Well, Mr. Chairman, Sir, as you know, we have taken a number of measures.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah:- Mr. Chairman, Sir, lest the Chief Minister may forget. The point which I raised the other day is that I have made a specific suggestion of employment in the Secretariat. I have made a specific suggestion that in the matter of employment in the higher administrative echelon of the Secretariat, now that we have many I.A.S. tribal officers, I think it is high time to consider giving them the very important key posts like Home, Finance, etc.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Alright, Mr. Chairman, Sir, we can discuss this question, Sir, may I make it very clear that while we have discussed this matter together, we want to give a practical and realistic arrangement of posting officers to be incharge of different departments. But in spite of our best efforts, sometimes we land into difficulty and I think one very important point should be borne in mind that if on that consideration we try to put a particular officer to be in-charge of a particular department, it will amount to lack of confidence on our own officers. Sir, to run the administration efficiently and effectively, I think we must have the confidence both in non-tribal and tribal officers.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, I have raised that. In fact yesterday my point is that we have so many tribal officers who can man these departments.  

Shri. B.B. Lyngdoh :- It is not a question of complete replacement but it is a question of rotation.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Government always exercises its own discretion. It is not desirable and I think it is not wise also from the administrative point of view to allow a particular officer to remain stagnant in the same department as that will rob him of varied experience but there are some other considerations. As you know Mr. Chairman, Sir, in the legislative front, as I said we are trying to bring some legislative measures to help the Government to contain the population structure of the tribals through the Residential Permit Bill, but we failed. But with the help and cooperation of the other side, we will try to find out in what reasonable way we can protect the interest of the tribals to contain the population structure. Well, this morning we have discussed the Land Transfer Bill. This is another matter. The threat by non-tribals is also another matter. In Garo Hills, residence tell is another matter I was suggesting to the Khasi Hills and Jaintia Hills District Councils that the residence toll is to check indirectly on the influx from outside. Of course, there will become difficulty about the land system here in Khasi Hills. In Garo Hills, every family pays the house tax and land revenue. These are the floating population. During the peak seasons, hundreds and hundreds come from Bihar or the neighbouring States. But they do not pay any tax or revenue. So we have introduced that regulation and that they have to pay. If they stay for 3 months, they have to pay  a different rate and if for 6 months or one year, they have to pay different rates. If the contractor fails to get the local labourers according to the regulation, it is the obligation of the contractor to inform the competent authority that he is bringing such and such number of labourers. Then the prescribed toll has to be paid and we have to see that those people go back and if they want to stay they must get the permission of from the District Council. That is the indirect way of doing it. From this, Mr. Chairman, Sir, it will appear that we are not sleeping over the matter. Now, on economic front, a number of measures have been taken but unfortunately sometimes the concession we offered does not go to the benefit of our own people because of the benami transactions. In this, I think I will agree and repeat the slogan which was made the hon. Member from Mawlai," what have I done" - 'What have we done to protect the interest of our tribal people.' Unless I want to help myself, no measures taken by the Government can help me. Let us cite an example. Suppose a petrol pump has been settled in a tribal land, but he man behind is somebody else. Contacts have been settled with the tribals and lumpsum amounts promised by somebody else. They allowed the giant share to go to somebody else. The man who is behind all these transactions, get double benefit. He does not require to pay income tax and the giant share goes to him. Who is to correct. It is not my own duty of course. The question will have to be examined that because of financial difficulty, they have no other alternative, but to give the contract to somebody else. But I think this is not a valid reason. I know there are some difficulties in getting loans from the financial institutions but at least regarding this matter, we will examine how to make the financial help flow more rapidly. There also, we have to put our heads together. We know there are certain difficulties.............

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, may I suggest one point because this concerns all the members. The other day Mr. Khongwir the hon. Member from Mawlai, had spoken of this evil practice and we are else trying our best to root out this evil. One of the steps that we have though then and even now is that I feel there are certain cases whether in the business of cinema or business of contractors or other trades there is a very clear case of benami transaction. Now we feel that if a deterrent action is taken in one or two cases, it will bring a salutary effect. We know that there are cases which are open and we cannot do by law. We know very well that these things are going on openly. So, it is our suggestion that we take a strong action to act as a deterrent. This will bring a very good lesson. I think the Government has a role to play and at the same time I agree with the Chief Minister that we as members and as public leaders have to play a big role.

Mr. Chairman :- You have already stated that you cannot provide it by law.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- There are licenses which are renewed.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Again my colleague from Nongthymmai may recall when we went together to attend the National Development Council and some other conference. This benami transaction is prevalent throughout the country and it also goes abroad. Now the legal policy we discussed was whether we could prevent it by law or not. We will try to pursue this matter Mr. Chairman, Sir, and see whether licenses could be given to prevent this benami transaction but in absence of the law it will not be possible to implement the suggestion given by the hon. members from Jaiaw. Suppose A is known to have taken up a benami transaction in case of some road work, then, the only thing we can do is to black-list him. But a deterrent cannot be taken against him in absence of any law. But in this we would like to have the co-operation of all and somebody should have the courage to see ..........

Mr. Chairman :- The benami transaction does not exist only between tribals and non-tribals, it also exists between tribals and tribals.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- That is your information Mr. Chairman, Sir. So that was about benami transaction on various business and contract works. As already pointed out by the hon. Member from Jaiaw that they have also taken up a very ambitious scheme.. the Co-operative Housing scheme to encourage our tribal people to take up the business and the concept of the scheme was to provide house-cum shop to our tribal place. But not only to tribals because we should all remember about the composition of the population of the State as a whole. Our idea should be that in a particular trade centre where there are about 100 houses, we should remember that 80 percent should go to tribal and rest should go to the non-tribals and others so that there would be a fair play and there would be scope for others too. At least we should see that we are looking after their interests also so that all of them must make a better progress in their trade. I know there are some difficulties when this programme is taken up. There will be scope for benami transaction also. The hon. Member from Mawlai has said about the Tura Bazar where the District Council has constructed shops- for one Omuk Sangma, yet the man inside the shop was has doing business in somebody else like Mr. Sharma. I think the hon. Members are a bit tired. I can cite a story - when I joined the Government of Assam as a Cabinet Minister, I was allotted a Bungalow which was occupied by Mr. Sarma. The signboard was not removed as yet. When some "Ministers" who were looking after some buildings met the Law Minister, he suggested to them to meet the Minister, Tribal Affairs. He gave them the direction and they came to the gate, but at the gate, they found the signboard in the name of Mr. Sarma, and went back. So that is very clear. Mr. Chairman, Sir. They picked up the information as Sarma out and Sarma in, which unfortunately but the signboard should be attached to might mean as Sangma in and Sangma out their heart. It is the duty of every-one to feel that once they are attached by that name they should go on by that name. If I am Mr. Sangma, definitely I am Mr. Sangma everywhere I go, if you are Mr. Kyndiah, you are Mr. Kyndiah... (Laughter) ... Therefore, Mr. Chairman, Sir, apart from whatever legislative measures which can be initiated and taken up for better administration, with the cooperation of all, there should be a peaceful atmosphere and friendly understanding how to take up some developmental schemes which will really promote the economic condition of the people in our State, unless and until we ourselves are determined to the fullest advantage on certain matters, it may not be possible for us to help our own people. What I want to say is that it will not be possible to explore their difficulties if we are not determined to the fullest extent. The interest of the weaker section of the scheduled caste and scheduled tribes is provides for under the Constitution in order to protect, to help and to develop them as quickly as possible. This is very necessary for all of us to get the good-will from different sections of the population and we should not speak any word, we should not do anything which will give scope for suspicion. But in a peaceful and friendly atmosphere we can proceed with speed in executing all the developmental programmes and also run the administration efficiently and without hindrances. Therefore, let us remember, Mr. Chairman, Sir, the prerequisite to implement all the measures in developmental activities in a peaceful and friendly atmosphere. That sense must prevail and it should be the attempt of everyone of us to do so without hindrances so that we can proceed ahead with the programme. We should create a peaceful and friendly atmosphere.

        Now I would like to go into the details how to create that peaceful atmosphere. I would request through you, Sir, that every responsible leader of this House should think about it, should create a conditions for such atmosphere. There are many ways and means of doing it. It always  the policy of the Congress as well as of the A.P.H.L.C. that every citizen of Meghalaya should be taken as our own people. They must be allowed to get their own share. There should be no discrimination at all. It will be also the duty of the more advanced societies within Meghalaya to join hands with the Government in trying to promote the interest of the tribal people. I would repeat, Mr. Chairman, Sir, that all our concern for the protection of the tribal interest and to bring programme for their quick advancement in all-round development cannot be effectively implemented unless and until we are in a position to maintain communal harmony and thereby create peaceful and friendly atmosphere. That is number one within the State. We must go beyond the State also. As I have been telling, we cannot think even for a moment to live in isolation. So whatever we do, whatever we proceed it should be appreciated by the more advanced States that these people are moving in the right direction. We must get their good-will, we must get their support and co-operation. Mr. Chairman, Sir, well, this is a motion for discussion and I have been expected to reply to the points raised. It is my duty to appreciate it with you and also express my equal concern like other hon. Members of the House. Since the time at our disposal is not enough I am not going to enumerate further the various measures both in the economic and social fronts which we have taken every since Meghalaya came into existence for the protection of our people. But I must at least say Mr. Chairman, Sir, because of certain difficulties, our people for various reasons, have not been able to enjoy fully the benefit which should have gone to them. It may be due to our own faults. So, may I just resume my seat with an appeal to all hon. Members of this House as public representatives and public leaders to be always in readiness in our joint efforts to work in full co-operation. This is a common concern. This is a must. Unless and until we can do it as somebody said the "achievement of the full State will have no meaning". I agree with that. But this State has come with the goodwill of the nation as a whole. So, we are very anxious to device ways and means of protecting the interest of our tribal people. Let us not forget one very important point that without which it may be a dream on our part to think of various measures either in the social front or economic front. For such matters we must also get the goodwill of the nation as a whole we have achieved our political goal. To achieve our prosperity and all round development in these attempt at every stage we must get the goodwill of the State as a whole in the first instance and also of the country as a whole. With these words, Mr. Chairman, Sir, I resume my seat.

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, we have had a very interesting discussion on this very important motion. Altogether we have had 4 hours discussion on this subject and it appears that each hon. Member wanted to participate because he also is a tribal and he would like to speak on behalf of the tribal interest. But unfortunately the procedure is that only the Chief Minister to reply to this motion and the other Hon'ble Ministers cannot have a chance to speak for the interest of the tribals.

        So, Mr. Chairman, Sir, I have listened very attentively to the reply made by the Chief Minister in this regard. I would only remind the House of one very important thing that was posed in some questions. That problem was that a line was drawn on the floor and the problem was posed how to shorten the line without touching it and nobody could solve the problem and then came along Mr. Birbal by the side of that line. He draw a longer line, so automatically the other line become shorter. So this is our fear, Mr. Chairman, Sir, less the tribal line will become shorter by drawing a long line in the State. Now, Mr. Chairman, Sir,, it is very gratifying to hear from the Chief Minister that out of the total number of employees about 2,164 both in the Secretariat and the Directorates are tribals. It constitutes 88 percent. But we would make an appeal, although we know that it does not fall within the purview of the State Government, we had already made an appeal to the Government to utilise their good offices to go into the matter of employment in the Central Government offices. I still remember, in the past, the Chief Minister had already assured this august House that his Government would do its level best to have to take up the matter so that our young people could have a chance to enter in the Central Government offices. I still think that the Chief Minister holds to this idea and the assurance he had already made a few years ago.

Mr. Chairman :- Mr. Khongwir, are you going to bring in new points ?

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- No, Sir, I think I am going to wind it up. I think according to the rules we have got the right of reply and if the Government is tired, let the Government say this.

Shri. Bareh (Minister, Agriculture) :- When the Chief Minister has given his reply, what is more there to speak about ?

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- According to rules, I think we have got a right of reply. Let us stop a few minutes and look to the rule whether it permits or not.

Mr. Chairman :- In so far clarification is concerned I think the member who moved the motion has the right to say one or two words.

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- I am definite, Mr. Chairman, Sir, that there is a provision in the rules that in a motion, the mover of the motion has got the right of reply. Let me complete first and then we will look to the rules later on (laughter).

Shri. E. Bareh (Minister, Agriculture) :- I think we accept it.

Mr. Chairman :- I think the rule provides, Rule 283 (3) reads as follows :

        "A member who have moved a motion may speak again by way of reply, and if the motion is moved by a private member, the Minister concerned may, with the permission of the Speaker speak whether he has previously spoken in the debate or not after the mover has replied". So, when the rule permits, we have to go according to the rules.

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, one very important point I would like to bring  home to the Government through you, is with regard to the bazars. I will not bring many points in so far as bazars are concerned but there is one case which I know very well. This is the bazar here in Shillong. As I have said earlier there are so many tribals owners of shops at Bara Bazar who wanted to get back their shops but it has become very difficult for them to get back their shops because they have rented out to the non-tribals. I do not know whether the Government can go in to help those people who wanted that their shops be restored to the previous owners. So, I would suggest to the Government, through you, Sir, to come together to assist the Syiem of Mylliem and also the District Council to see to this problem because I know of several cases, in not less than 15 cases the owners of those shops which they have rented out about five years ago to the non-tribals, now they cannot get back those shops from the non-tribals although they want to do business of their own in those shops. About the benami transaction it is really a problem. But the Chief Minister also has suggested our cooperation in this regard. Mr. Chairman, Sir, we would like to be very clear on this point since we from this side of the House have already assured the Government that we will render all necessary help in so far as this matter is concerned. I went to know from the Government whether they will respond to our co-operation because there is no point if in giving our co-operation, if there is no regard from the Government, it will be futile, it will be meaningless to work for the interest of the tribals, it will be meaningless to work for the interest of the tribals and to bring information to Government with regard to the benami transaction. So I want that the Government will really respect our co-operation in so far as benami transaction is concerned and I would suggest to each and every one of us that is necessary to educate our people as the Chief Minister has already mentioned. This phenomenal growth really means exploitation. Why there is benami. The fact remains that we are backward. That is why the stronger sections of other communities have control over us and that is why exploitation has come. So I feel that it is our duty to educate our people in this regard and the last point that the Chief Minister has failed to mention is with regard to the policy so far followed by the Congress Party and the APHLC. Here in this House there are three groups, one is Congress, another is the APHLC and also Sir, the smallest group in this House - the HSPDP. Mr. Chairman, Sir, it is also the policy not only of the Congress, not only of the APHLC but it is also the policy of the HSPDP not to fight against the tribals but the only thing we have fought and accepted is; it is not a sin to love our own community and in that process if somebody thinks that we are hating other it is very wrong. So also it is our policy that harmony, the complete harmony should be maintained in Meghalaya. So with these few words, Mr. Chairman, Sir, since it is a motion. I do not have to withdraw it. But I have already moved and I like very much the information given by the Chief Minister to this important aspect of the matter. We will proceed ahead and we can protect the interest and also preserve the identity of our tribal people. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Sir.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- Well, Mr Chairman, Sir, I have only replied to the points that have been raised with regard to cooperation. I think the word used should be understood in is proper context. I said when we jointly, with the approval of the House have taken certain measures, economic measures, legislative measures in the implementation of the various developmental programmes, there must be complete co-operation. Co-operation is some sort of exercise in trying to find out what measures, both economic and legislative, should be taken. Therefore, there should be no scope for misunderstanding in the House for the use of this word "Co-operation". It is not a one-way traffic but it is a both-way traffic. Well Mr. Chairman, Sir, I think, I had an occasion a number of times in the House to speak with regard to the employment in the Central offices located in Shillong and elsewhere. We have taken up this matter with Delhi, we will continue to take it up. I hope we can do something. I know we can exercise or good offices in trying to make the Government of India realise that we are following up our policy that certain percentage of posts should be filled up by the local people and we will try to continue this process. Well Mr. Chairman, Sir, I have not indicated in my reply that, at the cost of our tribal community, we should do something for others. I think there is certain misderstanding in that I have made it very clear that, in order to achieve our goal for the preservation of the identity and for the protection of the interest of the tribals, we must be able to create a state of peace and through our own efforts convince others of our bonafides. I will give an example, Mr. Chairman, Sir, of what we have been able to do this during our movement for a State of ours. My erstwhile colleagues who worked together with me then would agree with me that we won over the good will of the different people to our side, and it was with their good will that we ultimately succeeded to get a political settlement, to get our own State. I, therefore, want the hon. Members to realise that there is a great goal before us. The goal is to protect and preserve our identity, our distinct identity in various spheres and we can achieve this only with the good will from all sections of the people and from the country as a whole. I will make it very clear that when I say that we must win over the good-will of other people, it does not mean that we have failed to love our own community. I believe, Mr. Chairman, Sir, that this reply of mine has refuted the charge that Captain Sangma is anti-tribal.

Mr. Chairman :- Now the discussion on Motion No.1 is closed. I will call upon Mr. Kyndiah to move Motion  o.2.

Shri. P.R. Kyndiah :- In view of the information I received that the Education Department has drawn up a scheme to give special scholarship for the meritorious students, I am not going to move my motion.

Mr. Chairman :- Let us come now to Motion No.3. But Mr. R. Lyngdoh is absent and the motion is deemed to have been withdrawn. Motions No.4 and No.6 seem to be of similar nature, I think the hon. Member will not object if we club them.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, may I make a statement that I would like to exercise my right in motion No.6 with your permission to raise Motion No.6, and motion No.8, which also stands in my name.

Mr. Chairman :- Prof. Majaw, this has been done according to the ballot and so it has been given like that. Otherwise, somebody will raise the same question.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- I received an indication from the Speaker because I made a request to him that in place of motion No.6, I may be allowed to move motion No.8. But the Speaker decided to put the question before the House.

Mr. Chairman :- That question we have to decide later on because we have to consult the rules and for the present, you do not have any objection to those two motions if we club them and for motion No.6, only the member who will move, will have the right of reply.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that this House do now discuss functioning of the Meghalaya House at Calcutta and its ancillary matters.

Mr. Chairman :- Motion moved. Now you can discuss.

*Shri. Winstone Syiemiong :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, it is matter of regret that comparatively and relatively speaking this subject should at all be required to be discussed in this House. When we compare with the first motion which relates to the very same nature with motion No.4 which is being moved by me, it  is not very important and the fact is this. You will realise that during the last few days, from the beginning of this House itself, there have been so many questions that were put to this House and I have counted that there are as many as 4 questions. So, Sir, you will realise that the subject matter is not so very important but, certainly, there is something wrong going on in this House which needs be discussed in this House. You will see that the very first question on the first day posed by the hon. Member from Mawlai Shri. S.D. Khongwir when this House assembled was whether the Government had received complaints on the functioning of this Meghalaya House and to which the Government had replied that there were complaints. You will see how this particular matter is raised by referring to question No.31 which was put by the hon. member from Mawhati and myself. The Government have admitted that there was something wrong in it. In that question you will see the list or priority that was made for accommodation in the Meghalaya House at Calcutta. It was not in order. It was corrected till they had received this very question from us. I have definite information that the list of protocol or priority for accommodation at the Calcutta Meghalaya House was not in order prior to the receipt of our question. In the original list of protocol they have placed the Meghalaya M.L.As of this Assembly on Serial 35, if I am not mistaken. Altogether, these are 37 numbers of various types of officers or gradations and there are M.L.As have come as No.35, M.Ps. 36 and the Superintending Engineer of the P.W.D. as No.25. You can very well imagine how even this small District Sub-divisional Officers could get in the said List of Protocol when others like the M.L.As are not included therein. From this, you will find that something very fishy is going on. Mr. Chairman, Sir, I seldom went to Calcutta during the last 5 years. It was only on two occasions that I have had the chance to past through Calcutta. But one strange thing that strikes me is that whenever I  go to or pass through Calcutta, my friend who came along with me at that time, always remarks whenever we discuss the Meghalaya House against the Trade Advisory who is running the Meghalaya House. I was surprised especially when he told me that they had made various complaints to the Government and that nothing has come out of it. I was just thinking what type of man this person was and I was wondering to what caused the Government to remain silent on these complaints. Last month, when I was returning from Bombay as one of the members of the Estimates Committee, fortunately or unfortunately I have never had the occasion to meet the Trade Adviser personally, I was in the other room and I suddenly saw this particular officer - who was always referred to as a very argument type - confronting the Acting Chairman of the Estimates Committee in the very room allotted to the Chairman. I was just wondering how this officer could have the guts and boldness to come straight to the room and talked to the Acting Chairman as if he was a students, as if the hon. Members would have to ask for some arrangements for accommodation. But this is irrelevant compared to the very posture, arrogance and noises and shouts that the made . Then immediately after that I started making enquiries and found out that this was not the first occasion that he had behaved in such a manner to the Members of this August House. There was an occasion, I am told that Chairman of the Subordinate Legislation Committee - when this Committee went out on tour outside Meghalaya and passed through Calcutta - was given a slip of paper by the peon in asking the Chairman to come to his room. The Chairman was virtually ordered to go to his room. There was another occasion when one very hon. member of Parliament of the Shillong Parliamentary Constituency went to Delhi in the month of March when he halted at Calcutta House. This very gentleman did not even provide him with any facilities like bed-sheet or room for almost a day. He did not even provide him with a pillow or bed-cover. The hon. Member from Mawlai was there; he will bear witness.

Shri. S.D. Khongwir :- Yes, Yes.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- Sir, had it been centred upon the MLAs only I would not have felt so much. Perhaps the hon. Members of this House have their short-coming or that this man is allergic towards them. But it is not really like that. Actually from his contact with all types of people, his manner was always been the same. Then other complaints have been raised that there are officers of this State Government who have been mis-behaved by him. There was an officer, if I am not mistaken, who is a Chief Engineer of P.H.E. Department who was not allowed or given accommodation at particular time in this House when due reservation had been made. There were other occasions also when member of the public who had got due recommendation from Ministers were not given accommodation. There was a case of a Dolloi of Jowai. he was .........

(A voice - Pator)

not given any accommodation although there was a room vacant. Then there was a case of a gentleman who was recommended by the Education Minister who was not given ....

Mr. Chairman :- Probably he did not know that Pator.

Shri. W. Syiemiong :- But he knows the recommendation of the Minister. He may know the Petor. Then there were cases where he mis-behaved with people and as the Director of Movements who has some connection with tourism, on many occasions he even mis-behaved with tourists. There was an occasions in which he insulted a Swedish or Norwagian tourist about his dress saying "Your type is not welcomed in Meghalaya" Who is this man to say like this because we want our State to develop tourism. But this man, the Director of Movements insulted almost each and every one of these foreigners who go there. There was also a case of a British tourist who was there with another gentleman from this State and for no reach this man just flared up and without any rhymes or reason told that British tourist with an accusing finger saying " "Don't you know there is no more British rule" ? Such are the rude behaviours that are very often made by this Trade Adviser. Not only that, there was of another man.

Mr. Chairman :- Probably he will deny.

Shri. Winstone Syiemiong :- Anyway, I have cited just a few examples and I believe various examples can be cited, if the Government care to look into the affairs of this particular man in Meghalaya House, Calcutta. Why the Government remained quite for so long. It is said that the people who are serving there are treated very very badly. I was told by some of the grade IV staff that they being treated like domestic servants. They are to serve according to his whims and wishes. He is also misusing the official car even though the members of the various Committee who went on tour outside are not being provided with the car. Last time the Estimates Committee requested him to fetch the Members from Howrah who were coming from Bombay but the Trade Adviser did not bother to fetch them nor to send the car. I wonder why the Government has not done anything even though there was complaints as far back as 1975. Something should have been done. Then there are complaints about the quality of food that is being served and the treatment meted out to the teachers, students who happen to pass through the Meghalaya House. Sir, I therefore feel that something must be done and some enquiry should be made. Mere transfer will not do. In place of him a more polite and more courteous person preferably a tribal should be appointed.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Mr. Chairman, Sir, I think this gentleman is the most poplar figure of this Session. Regarding this gentleman we had questions in this House, calling-attention motion, and motions; and we now have in the order paper a discussion raised under rule49 by the hon. Member from Mynso-Raliang.

Mr. Chairman :- Do you mean to say he is more popular than the Budget itself ?

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Although he is not more popular than the Budget, it is also true that he has been widely discussed. But I would like to bring two or three salient points to the attention of the House.

(Mr. Deputy Speaker took the Chair)

        First of all, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I had the privilege of acting as Chairman of the Estimates Committee and we went out of this State on tour, a month ago. I requested one of the members of our staff, belonging to this Assembly, to inform this particular officer to send an official car to fetch us from Dum Dum Airport; but, instead, he rebuked this officer. He said - "Do they think it is in Shillong ? This is Calcutta !". This was verbally communicated to me by that officer of the Assembly. So, I thought it would be better if we wrote a formal letter to him, and as such, I wrote as formal letter requesting him to send the car to Howrah, for which we would pay as the usual rate. But, on our return from Bombay, we were kept waiting at Howrah for an hour-and-a-half. The Trader Adviser did not send the car to Howrah and we had to hire a taxi to come to Meghalaya House. When we came to Meghalaya House this gentleman in question had quite a row with the hon. Member from Nongspung, over the question of serving breakfast in our rooms. His first remark to us was this it was not the Estimates Committee only that visited Calcutta, there are so many Committees passing through and it was not possible to look after all of them, he added. He said that they were only particular about serving the V.I.Ps but I do not know what he meant by V.I.Ps. The Estimates Committee, which is one of the highest elected Committees of this House is also of V.I.P status. I do not know whether he was aware of the rules until I informed him of the prestigious position of the Executive Committee. I told him that the Estimates Committee was like a mini-Assembly, representing all sections of the House. I think he exercised his prudence and ultimately served a poor breakfast in our rooms. He then produced a list of priority, but he did not know that in the meantime that priority list had been changed by the Government. According to his priority list, M.L.As are below the rank of a P.A. to a Minister and the lowest position is given to M.Ps. When we asked him for the rules, he said if we wanted to see the rules we would have to go to his office ! This particular gentleman has been accommodated on the second floor of the Meghalaya House, occupying several rooms there.

Shri. W.A. Sangma (Chief Minister) :- I would like to inform that he has got 7 rooms.

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Now, from the reply of the Chief Minister we have come to know that he occupies 7 rooms which is too spacious an accommodation. Even the Chief Minister does not get 7 rooms while passing through Calcutta. But under the terms and conditions of his appointment, this gentleman has to find accommodation elsewhere. Temporarily, he was accommodated at the Meghalaya House. But this temporary accommodation has become permanent. There, his home-mistress, I mean his wife, shouts and scolds the grade IV employees working at the Meghalaya House like domestic servants of hers. And what is most unfortunate, Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, is that this gentleman was allowed to draw house rent for more or less 2 year while staying free of cost at the Meghalaya House. When it was discovered, he only remarked that it had happened through oversight. And so it was deducted from his pay in instalments. But he did not get any punishment. He should have been punished for this temporary misappropriation. He cannot take the plea of oversight since he is himself the Drawing and Disbursing Officer. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, there are many other things; but we do not want unnecessarily to destroy the character of that man. It is up to the Government to investigate these matters. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, only the other day when one M.P. visited the Meghalaya House at Calcutta and requested the Trade Adviser to give him a pillow just to take a little rest over there, that gentleman flatly refused even to spare a pillow. Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I have been told by the Grade IV employees of the Meghalaya House that even the essential commodities meant for the catering of the Meghalaya House are taken upstairs to feed his family. Another thing, Sir, when the Hon'ble Minister of Education was the Chairman of the Estimates Committee, this officer even refused to provide accommodation to the Chairman at the Meghalaya House. It has also been brought to my notice that even the relatives of that House. It has also been brought to my notice that even the relatives of that gentleman are allowed to enjoy food and lodging at the Meghalaya House. I, therefore, would like to request the Government to look into this matter thoroughly and let us know about the action taken in this matter.

Mr. Deputy Speaker :- The discussion on this motion is closed. We will continue it when we resume our sitting on Monday. Now let me come to the next item.

Shri. Humphrey Hadem :- Mr. Deputy Speaker, Sir, I think the time is up and the discussion on this particular subject has just begun and now can we close the discussion on this motion ?

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- Sir, I think it is for the discretion of the Speaker; but I will have to move through other provisions of the rules and we may take it up tomorrow.

Shri. Humphrey Hadem :- Sir, tomorrow is Sunday ! (Laughter).

Prof. M.N. Majaw :- I mean the next working day !.


Mr. Deputy Speaker :- Since the scheduled time is up, the House stands adjourned till 9.30 a.m. on Monday the 13th June 1977.


Dated Shillong


the 11th June 1977

Meghalaya Legislative Assembly